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  1. #1
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Need a new starter for the 5 as the solenoid connection has melted and broken up, would prefer a valeo as they last forever, although seen a RTX starter on ebay for a good price, Lucas ones are around £20 more. Anyone have experience of the RTX starters? these are also available from Euro Car Parts

  2. #2
    Non-member J$£5GTT's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    i have one of those weird airy fairy uprated k-tec cgb ones,been on the raider for over 4 years now with a heatshield,no failures at all.

    valeo are old school and prone to sticking like a tung to a nipple with super glue on it.

  3. #3
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Ah ok mate, who made your starter? bought a cheap & cheerful RTX unit, then thought better of it and swapped it for a Lucas starter the next day. I would have liked a new valeo if I could of got one as they last forever, my 11 turbo still has the original from 1986 with heatshield lol

  4. #4
    Non-member J$£5GTT's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    not sure who makes them,brand new valeo would be nice,but these new units are very reliable.

  5. #5
    Honorary Member Guybrush's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    wasn't the laguna starter the "uprated one"

  6. #6
    Moderator, Committee Trevhib's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Isn't there an issue with the Laguna starters when being used on a GTT?

  7. #7
    Committee, Shop Manager, SE Regional Rep Bigfoot's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Trevhib View Post
    Isn't there an issue with the Laguna starters when being used on a GTT?
    Apart from spinning over quicker, no problems as far as I am aware.

  8. #8
    Moderator, Committee Trevhib's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Well, doing a search brings up a number of threads. One with Mart saying to steer clear of Megane/Laguna type starters and one or two other members saying similar things.

    Maybe it's something to do with the dowel location, maybe it's to do with number of teeth, maybe it's to do with the associated heat-shield, maybe it's something else I haven't listed, maybe it's a mixture of the aforementioned, maybe it's all of the aforementioned.

    I'm not sure but if you're in the market for a new/reconditioned starter and are considering going with something that's not OE. Do some research on it first.

  9. #9
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    Re: Starter Motor

    From memory some had incorrect number of teeth?

  10. #10
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Went with the Lucas unit from Euro Car Parts about £75 exchange instead of the cheaper RTX unit from ECP thats non exchange,both specified for the gt turbo & c1j engine online as checks car registration

  11. #11
    Non-member TNT ANDY's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Laguna unit's don't like the radiant heat from the exhaust, so if you do fit one, make sure you have the downpipe wrapped and the heat shield in place.

  12. #12
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Pretty sure its not a laguna unit, probably have to take it off again to check! lol bought a starter heatshield so will pop that on soon

  13. #13
    Committee, NW Regional Rep Alex's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    It always makes me laugh when I hear the word "uprated" before starter motor. How can you have an unprated starter motor? It either starts the car or it doesn't!

  14. #14
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    It always makes me laugh when I hear the word "uprated" before starter motor. How can you have an unprated starter motor? It either starts the car or it doesn't!
    EXACTLY mate! aiiitt but it giv it anudder 15 BHP innit bruv

  15. #15
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    The one I fitted to the raider yesterday is a lucas LRS00505, not sure what that means but it was on the lucas box from Euro Car Parts, seems a good starter, turns over quickly and smoothly, 2 year warranty as well

  16. #16
    Non-member Brigsy's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    I recall somebody mentioning the so called uprated starter motors off the laguna had plastic internals?

  17. #17
    Moderator, Committee Trevhib's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Alluded to in the other thread

  18. #18
    Committee, Shop Manager, SE Regional Rep Bigfoot's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Raider View Post
    The one I fitted to the raider yesterday is a lucas LRS00505, not sure what that means but it was on the lucas box from Euro Car Parts, seems a good starter, turns over quickly and smoothly, 2 year warranty as well
    That's the right one for the car rather than the laguna version.

  19. #19
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Ok so ive fitted new starter, dowels there etc and when the car starts it sounds like the engine is turning the starter motor over as its running, not crunching noises just the whirring of the starter .

    Today Ive taken it off, checked it over put a battery on the starter and the solenoid pushes the cog as if to engage and turn the flywheel then shoots back when power taken away (key has stopped being turned). Any ideas why its doing this? dont want to run it for long like this and wreck the starter, could it be a relay? signal wire from ignition bad connection?

  20. #20
    Non-member Hoolio's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    It's supposed to do that, or am I misunderstanding.

  21. #21
    Non-member ScottKinnear's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    I'm not sure on your problem mate, but I bought the rtx starter first and the holes match up but the top one sits the starter in wrong. Grounded the crap out of my fly wheel. Changed it for the Lucas one and there are no problems

  22. #22
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoolio View Post
    It's supposed to do that, or am I misunderstanding.
    Well it starts engine fine,however i can hear the starter motor still whirring away say 20-30 seconds after ive released they key from start engine position,therefore engine is now turning starter motor over so its making a noise

  23. #23
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by ScottKinnear View Post
    I'm not sure on your problem mate, but I bought the rtx starter first and the holes match up but the top one sits the starter in wrong. Grounded the crap out of my fly wheel. Changed it for the Lucas one and there are no problems
    Oh no, I originally bought an RTX then next day took it back for a lucas, didnt even fit RTX heard they are pony lol

  24. #24
    Non-member Hoolio's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Raider View Post
    Well it starts engine fine,however i can hear the starter motor still whirring away say 20-30 seconds after ive released they key from start engine position,therefore engine is now turning starter motor over so its making a noise
    Ok but you say the drive is retracting as it should, so how can the engine carry on turning the motor?

  25. #25
    Detailing Mod Lowiepete's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Valeo Starter Motors here...

    With Season's Greetings,
    Steve

  26. #26
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoolio View Post
    Ok but you say the drive is retracting as it should, so how can the engine carry on turning the motor?
    Connected to a battery in garage and it retracts,not sure if it does it on the car however can hear it seems to be getting turned over by the engine.

  27. #27
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Still got the same problem,is the LRS00505 made for the gtt? could it be a wiring fault somewhere causing engine to turn starter over whilst engine running?

  28. #28
    Committee Member chris's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Start it up and take exciter wire off see if it stops the noise thats the best way

  29. #29
    Non-member TNT ANDY's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Raider View Post
    Still got the same problem,is the LRS00505 made for the gtt? could it be a wiring fault somewhere causing engine to turn starter over whilst engine running?
    Need a bit of TNT buddy?

  30. #30
    Non-member TNT Tricky Nicky's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Is the key coming out of the starting position? Might be ignition barrel, just happened to be sticking now as you've been giving it more wellie due to the starter motor playing up before

  31. #31
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    Start it up and take exciter wire off see if it stops the noise thats the best way
    Lol that thought did cross my mind

  32. #32
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by TNT ANDY View Post
    Need a bit of TNT buddy?
    Yeah think so fella, Tuesday dayime inkeeping with TNT

  33. #33
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by TNT Tricky Nicky View Post
    Is the key coming out of the starting position? Might be ignition barrel, just happened to be sticking now as you've been giving it more wellie due to the starter motor playing up before
    As far as I know although could give it a turn back from starting postion take barrel out and clean up? Starter relay playing up maybe?

  34. #34
    Non-member TNT ANDY's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Raider View Post
    Yeah think so fella, Tuesday dayime inkeeping with TNT
    I'm back in work bud, can havea butchers Friday night if you want.

  35. #35
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by TNT ANDY View Post
    I'm back in work bud, can havea butchers Friday night if you want.
    Thanks Andy, going to take another look tomorrow and see whats what

  36. #36
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Had another look at the starter today, not the best conditions for it! lol All back together, starter heatshield fitted, exhaust back on. I have now remotely connected the white starter wire, so the white wire from iginition is connected to a longer wire, and another spade put on the starter itself so that I can get it to start then disconect these wires to see if it is the ignition barrel. Anyways ive done this and I seem still to be hearing the starter being turned over by the engine with these wires i fitted today disconnected

  37. #37
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by J$£5GTT View Post
    not sure who makes them,brand new valeo would be nice,but these new units are very reliable.
    Got a price for a new valeo one yesterday 75 + vat

  38. #38
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Thanks mate, where was this from out of interest? Got another starter on the way so be good to get this one on and see how it is

  39. #39
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    Re: Starter Motor

    My local motor factors but I'm from N Ireland.

  40. #40
    Non-member J$£5GTT's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie View Post
    Got a price for a new valeo one yesterday 75 + vat
    cool,just make sure to fit the oe heat shield with it!

  41. #41
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Yea, got a new one. Cheers

  42. #42
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Ok,I bought another starter as the Lucas from Euro Car Parts seemed to be getting turned over by engine once started and making a strange noise. Fitted the other starter today, the gear that tuns flywheel appers not as exposed/sticking out compared to Lucas starter. Anyways all fitted,fire it up and ive stil got same noise that starter is being turned!!! flywheel appears ok although will have a closer look, whats causing this? electrical issue or damaged flywheel causing starter to not disengage?

  43. #43
    Non-member Dre5gtt's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Your not having much luck are you mate

  44. #44
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    Re: Starter Motor

    If you have has multiple starters and the problem hasn't changed, that would suggest it's not the starter motor causing the issue...assuming its fitted right and the dowel is in place.

    What makes you think it's the starter motor? Just a sound? Have you traced it with a stethoscope or similar?

  45. #45
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveL485 View Post
    If you have has multiple starters and the problem hasn't changed, that would suggest it's not the starter motor causing the issue...assuming its fitted right and the dowel is in place.

    What makes you think it's the starter motor? Just a sound? Have you traced it with a stethoscope or similar?
    The old valeo starter was fine apart from when the solenoid went, Ive fitted 2 replacement starters and once started the engine the starter is whirring away even though key released and exciter wire is disconnected, dowel is in gearbox top right bolt hole as viewed from passenger wing, fitted correctly bolts nipped up etc. Positive wire with exciter on top solenoid terminal, negative on bottom solenoid terminal,exciter terminal on spade. You can hear starter still turning when engines running

  46. #46
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Raider View Post
    Positive wire with exciter on top solenoid terminal, negative on bottom solenoid terminal,exciter terminal on spade. You can hear starter still turning when engines running
    Lets make sure this bit is right: You should only have TWO connections from the car to the starter.

    1) The exciter wire, which is a spade terminal to the back of the solenoid.
    2) The main power feed from the battery +ve to the back of the solenoid, 13mm M8 nut.

    The earth is through the casing/gearbox. You do not connect an earth lead.

    There is also a connection from the main solenoid +ve in to the motor of the unit, but this is integral to the starter motor assembly. You should only connect one spade terminal and one M8/13mm nut ring terminal.

    Top right image of the 3, you only connect to the top M8 nut. Don't touch the bottom one.




    NOTE: I refer to starter motor connections only. In many cases, like the 21, there is a lead from the same terminal on the starter main +ve to the Alternator. I cannot remember if this is the case on the 5.

  47. #47
    Non-member car.crash's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Raider View Post
    Ok,I bought another starter as the Lucas from Euro Car Parts seemed to be getting turned over by engine once started and making a strange noise. Fitted the other starter today, the gear that tuns flywheel appers not as exposed/sticking out compared to Lucas starter. Anyways all fitted,fire it up and ive stil got same noise that starter is being turned!!! flywheel appears ok although will have a closer look, whats causing this? electrical issue or damaged flywheel causing starter to not disengage?
    Count the teeth on both starters, the uprated ones had a extra tooth, I had to swap the ring gear on a flywheel as the starter destroyed it. Seen it on a few engines
    This was the new slim black one the was not on exchange opposed to the old fat one.

  48. #48
    East Midlands Area Rep Mr Raider's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Dave, thanks for that mate,i have however connected the exciter wire & also the wire with the exciter from connector of death to top solenoid connection and other wire with starter support bracket to bottom solenoif connection,both M8 nuts as per haynes. Have I misinterpreted this or got it wrong? lol

  49. #49
    Non-member TNT Tricky Nicky's Avatar
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Raider View Post
    Dave, thanks for that mate,i have however connected the exciter wire & also the wire with the exciter from connector of death to top solenoid connection and other wire with starter support bracket to bottom solenoif connection,both M8 nuts as per haynes. Have I misinterpreted this or got it wrong? lol
    Take a picture bud, i'm confused as to what you've put where. I read that as the alternator wiring is on the same connector as exciter? If so thats why, as soon as the engine is running the starter is being excited by the alternator wiring is the battery warning light going out?

    Spade connecter on top of starter = exciter
    Battery lead + alternator wire = 13mm m8 nut
    As daveL(485 these numbers are important) said
    Last edited by TNT Tricky Nicky; 12-01-2014 at 00:08. Reason: Engine has to be running to make alternator work, not ignition on

  50. #50
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    Re: Starter Motor

    Quote Originally Posted by TNT Tricky Nicky View Post
    Take a picture bud, i'm confused as to what you've put where. I read that as the alternator wiring is on the same connector as exciter? If so thats why, as soon as the engine is running the starter is being excited by the alternator wiring is the battery warning light going out?

    Spade connecter on top of starter = exciter
    Battery lead + alternator wire = 13mm m8 nut
    +1, picture please.

    Quote Originally Posted by TNT Tricky Nicky View Post
    As daveL(485 these numbers are important) said
    you tit!

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