Finally got my mits on a 5 again

[Matty]

Well after a 12 year dry spell of not owning a GTT I got back in one today, took it for a test drive, and bought it. it's been stored for 4 years, and started first time every time (even on the old fuel that was in it), no horrible noises, or smoke. But it does need a clutch. It made it home through a 100mile trip and drove really well.

It's going to be a bit of a slow project, as I plan to have this as my daily for now. So any work on it will be, easy fixes etc...

The to do list.

Replace clutch - anything else worth doing at same time? Cable?release bearing?
Fix speedo as it doesn't work - is it mechanical or electrical driven?
Fix rear right indicator as it doesn't work
Full service, engine oil, gearbox, oil, brake fluid, coolant before winter
Replace indicator lenses, and fog lights with original colour
Fit bumper strips
Maybe replace front springs as it seems to sit really high at the front?


Anyway pics...

[JP Racing]

Looks a nice tidy car welcome back to R5 ownership. It's a lovely base to start with and get your hands dirty fixing little bits and bobs

[Hoolio]

Front and rear bumper strips, now there's a small mortgage on their own. Looks like a nice one. OE do look stupidly high at the front but it might be worth checking to see if you have campus springs under there.

[Matty]

Yeah ive seen the price of them strips! It needs a bit of bodywork doing, most of which is covered up by the bumpers etc, so hopefully im going to avoid a respray for the time being.

Ive just had another good look over it this evening, and plenty of little bits and bobs that need doing. Rear door cards look a bit tatty, and rear quarter seals need replacing. Windows slow on operation, is guess they just need greasing on the runner mechanism?

It suits me fine though, something that I can tinker with but not something that I'd be worried to use daily because its immaculate.

I've seen a few others about the same height. From what I've been told, I have no reason to believe its been messed with at all, so they are hopefully stock GTT ones. Any way of telling what they are?

[LeeR5GTT]

welcome back to the 5 world!

a popular way of changing the clutch is engine out, so while its out, service the engine, fresh fluids etc, yeh fit a clutch kit, not just the plate. you could opt for a soft clutch pedal conversion too while your in there if that's your thing if its been stood for 4 years id change the clutch cable as they are a common weakness, use a genuine Renault cable only.

lekky windows are usually slow, you can try grease the mech/rubbers, but the motor could also be tired.

rear lamp fault could be a bad earth, wiring fault, bulb or circuit board fault in the cluster, check for water ingress and any other obvious signs

rear doorcards can be repaired using spray glue

does look a little high, might be worth comparing it against another local gt if you can

speedo is a common fault you can try various things, new sensor ( comes in two sections) or it could be the mech in the clocks

welcome to the club

[markg]

Hi, Looks good To help answer a few of your questions.

With regards replacing the clutch I would definitely be doing the release bearing as well. All the kits I have had come with that anyway. It's also worth factoring in your future plans and if you intend to run more power in the future fit an uprated clutch now. Personally I would also replace the cable as well, but use a genuine Renault one. GT Turbo Spares can help you out with all the bits. It is also worth checking the quadrant on the clutch pedal. Plenty of threads about that on here and worth doing before you replace the clutch as you never know the clutch may be OK but simply not adjusting the cable correctly at the pedal. I had that years ago and it was an expensive mistake getting a new clutch fitted so worth taking the time to check.

Speedo is electrical. There is a black connector on the n/s inner wing near to where the air filter is if its still running the OE setup. Iirc the cable is grey. Check the contacts at the connector first as it may be that simple.

Yellow fogs I believe are no longer available. Some people have gone for these which seem to be good, as is the price

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...m=301270473604

When you do the gearbox oil make sure you use the correct stuff. Again plenty of threads on here about that as well.

Good luck

[Matty]

Thanks for the advice, I'll have good search about. I've already been advised to fit the green box Valeo, which seems to be a Volvo clutch. If it is then its probably the same as I had fitted in my old GTT and didn't feel too bad on the foot.

I'll have a good look at other causes, i can definitely feel the car moving with my foot on the clutch and the biting point is right on the floor.

Is there a way to test if the speedo sensor is working? Does it work by giving a square wave pulsed signal like modern VR sensors?

Should the badge on the back have a white background?

[B18ftMOJO5]

nice car you got there. good luck getting the issues sorted. everything is easily sorted, enjoy the boosting

[Matty]

I started having a look into the clutch today, the more I thought about it the more the cable adjustment made sense. It never slipped just didn't disengage the box fully...anyway this is what I found on the box end...I can't seem to find these wonderfully engineered components on the renault parts list?

[Goobie]

H plate, white, non sun roof, onto a winner already mate.

Lovely clutch mod that.

[Matty]

Yep white and non sunroof were the top of my list, it's not fun getting dripped on in the winter.

Right, I've adjusted the ratchet mech as far as it would go, and without the "custom spacers" it was better than before, I then put the "custom spacer" back in and it's only dragging ever so slightly. Obviously it's still not right, so does this mean its the wrong length cable? The clutch peal has the white ratchet mech on it.

[markg]

first of all, if you havent already, have a read through the boards on adjusting the quadrant, you never know you may have missed a trick and there is a wealth of posts on the subject. If that's all good then as you were thinking you were going to have to replace the clutch anyway I would try a new cable and also make sure its routed correctly. Get one from GT Turbo Spares or CGB so you know 100% its the right cable for a GT Turbo. I seem to recall that it has been mentioned in the past there were a couple of different cable lengths. It may well be a cheap fix, if not you have a new cable for when/if you replace the clutch.

This thread might help - https://www.rtoc.org/boards/showthread.php?t=4800

I am trying to cast my mind back. I had the same sort of problem about 15 years ago. Clutch cable snapped so I got a new one from Renault. Biting point was then in the carpet so pretty much undriveable. Put some spacers on the cable at the clutch fork end just like yours and that made it a bit better and brought the biting point up a bit. Took the car into the main dealers who diagnosed a new clutch was needed. Got the car back after the clutch change and it was OK. However in hindsight the old clutch was probably fine. I also ended up changing the clutch pedal and quadrant etc but cant for the life of me remember if it was related to this issue.

[dickiegtt]

Good to see you bought it matty and are getting stuck in, good news she did a long run all good apart from the clutch. Good luck with the resto she's a nice original car that in the best colour

[Matty]

Yep had a good read through, I saw one thread that did mention a difference in cable length between the clutch pedal with the black ratchet and white one (from what I understood anyway). The way I adjusted it up was, I unhooked it at the clutch arm, then kind of squeezed the two sections of the quadrant together, so the teeth were engaging at the highest point, and got the Mrs to pull the clutch cable tight and hook it over the arm, whilst I held the quadrant in place. The cable doesn't seem to clipped in place anywhere, could that cause an issue? I had a good search through, and this was the method written up on the articles page.

The quadrant all looks to be in good condition, I was thinking that maybe the teeth were slipping. How tight should the cable be once adjusted, I seem to be easily able to pull it an inch or so past the point where it clips into the clutch arm?

The cable does look quite new, so I'm wondering whether the fitting of the cable and it not working may of been the final straw of why it was taken off the road.

[Matty]

Good to see you bought it matty and are getting stuck in, good news she did a long run all good apart from the clutch. Good luck with the resto she's a nice original car that in the best colour

Yep getting stuck in, I've got 3 weeks to try and get it on the road!

I decided to pull the gutter strips off to clean the mould out from behind. It didn't look too bad underneath, but there is a bit of surface rust where the panels join.

Indicator now works, it was just a dirty contact on the bulb. Has anyone got a rear light wing nut going spare? Mine had a nyloc nut holding it on, and inevitably rusted on and had to be drilled and split off.





After a good clean up. I'll treat the rust soon, as soon as I get the other bits done.



I also gave the gutter trim a good clean, and it came up well.

[markg]

The cable should be clipped in place on the bulkhead and the inner wing from what I recall. Someone else will confirm as its years since I changed one. I have read in the past about incorrectly routed cables causing issues so worth checking.

If the ratchet is suspect you can get replacements. I have a Renault kit which comes with the pedal arm as well which seems a bit overkill really. If they are still available I expect they must be north of £50 now. Not tried these but could be worth a go if a new quadrant is needed.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RENAULT-5-...item3f37f3bd8c

[Matty]

I've taken the air box out now to give it a clean up, and I can now see where the cable is routed. Your right there are clips on the inner wing, so I've clipped it back in now. I've got a list of bits I need from GT turbo spares, so I'll have a chat and get a new clutch cable. Is there a part number stamped on the cable any where at all? Is saw that quadrant, I may get one just to rule out that.

I spent this evening cleaning up the front end, as there was a bit of home made metal flake starting to go rusty.





It's cleaned up nicely, as has the grill.

[Matty]

A couple of questions, while I wait for my Haynes manual to arrive. Does anyone know where this wire should go?



What is this part? And where does it usually sit? (Part with 2 blue spade connectors) I've looked for pictures, but I can't seem to find it a picture of where it should be in the engine bay.

[markg]

Could be wrong but that looks like the speedo cable ?. If it is that explains the speedo problem then

Second one is the anti-perc fan sensor. Normally fits into the turbo heatshield which you dont have fitted.

[Steven Leece]

I'd say that the cut wire looks more like the brake pad wear sensor wire !?

[Mr Raider]

Great base for a project mate. Speedo cable is a beige colour, goes into a black 3 pin connector near passenger side suspension turret, goes into bulk head down behind carb with the small hose for boost gauge in same grommet. Could be the cable, clocks, 3 pin connector or pickup in the gearbox up near where exhaust comes down.

[Matty]

Could be wrong but that looks like the speedo cable ?. If it is that explains the speedo problem then

Second one is the anti-perc fan sensor. Normally fits into the turbo heatshield which you dont have fitted.

That would explain the lack of speedo. It runs in the same conduit as the boost sensor wires.

I had a good look for the wire, I think someone said it was grey and ran down the left hand side of engine bay?

Ah yeah that's rings a bell about the anti percent fan sensor now. Well the anti percent isn't working, so it could well be this, as its just floating about in the engine bay. I guess it's just a thermal switch? If I join the wires together would this switch the fan on, just to test if its a faulty switch, or just the fact it's not seeing enough heat.

[Matty]

Great base for a project mate. Speedo cable is a beige colour, goes into a black 3 pin connector near passenger side suspension turret, goes into bulk head down behind carb with the small hose for boost gauge in same grommet. Could be the cable, clocks, 3 pin connector or pickup in the gearbox up near where exhaust comes down.

Thanks, it's quite good sorting out all of these little problems, it's getting me familiar with everything, but easy and cheap to sort too. Everything seems to be there on the car, it's just had the usual half arse repairs done over the years, that need sorting. I found some welding that needs doing in the boot today, so I'll probably have the rear bumper off to have a good look around.

That wire is a beige colour. great i'll chase it though and see what's what. hopefully that may well solve the speedo not working.

[Steven Leece]

I'm pretty sure your picture is of the brake wear indicator wire!

Speedo cable is grey and comes out of the bulk head right of the servo in a rubber bung that also has the boost gauge pipe, runs across the bulk head to behind the airfilter box where it has a round 3 pin connector, this then goes to the gearbox, in to an L shaped black metal casing then in to the back of the gearbox. That's from memory tho so may be a little bit out but http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/161340014676 may give you a better idea.

Steve

[Matty]

I'm pretty sure your picture is of the brake wear indicator wire!

Speedo cable is grey and comes out of the bulk head right of the servo in a rubber bung that also has the boost gauge pipe, runs across the bulk head to behind the airfilter box where it has a round 3 pin connector, this then goes to the gearbox, in to an L shaped black metal casing then in to the back of the gearbox. That's from memory tho so may be a little bit out but http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/161340014676 may give you a better idea.

Steve

Thanks Steve, I'll have another look tomorrow. Thanks for the pic that gives me a better idea of what I am looking for.

[Steven Leece]

Not a problem

The 5 looks nice and original, and pretty complete which is good! Good luck with the restoration!! Looking forward to following your thread!

Steve

[Goobie]

100% the brake pad wear wire.

Just noticed our 5's must be brothers, my reg is H154 TGO!

[Trevhib]

Yep, that thing with the two blue spade connectors is the turbo heat shield sensor that the anti-perc fan uses (and yes it's just a thermal switch). Since you have no heat shield (and most don't), it has nowhere to mount to, so it just hangs about.

You have three choices with it. Either remove it (a lot of people just remove the entire perc-fan and gubbins), fit a heat shield (and fit the sensor to it), or tie-wrap the sensor in a position that is close to the turbo.

I'd probably go with the first option but keep all the parts.

[J8TRO]

Looks like a great motor mate, just an observation but the metal contamination on the front might re appear regularly depending what you have treated it with. A friend had a white 5 and it was a real problem, he would clean and polish it, and a few weeks later it would come back.

There is an awesome product called Iron X. It dissolves the metal particles in the paint (normally caused by brake pads) but can be caused by fall out if the car is parked anywhere industrial (foundries etc)

Highly recomend the stuff. You spray it on, leave it 5 mins, it breaks down the particles and turns a purple colour, then you just rinse / wipe it off.

Treated my mates car and its never come back.

[Hoolio]

Ahhh Iron x, THE worst smelling thing on the planet. Fact.

[Matty]

100% the brake pad wear wire.

Just noticed our 5's must be brothers, my reg is H154 TGO!

Haha could well be, only one digit different, they must of came from the same dealership?

[Matty]

Looks like a great motor mate, just an observation but the metal contamination on the front might re appear regularly depending what you have treated it with. A friend had a white 5 and it was a real problem, he would clean and polish it, and a few weeks later it would come back.

There is an awesome product called Iron X. It dissolves the metal particles in the paint (normally caused by brake pads) but can be caused by fall out if the car is parked anywhere industrial (foundries etc)

Highly recomend the stuff. You spray it on, leave it 5 mins, it breaks down the particles and turns a purple colour, then you just rinse / wipe it off.

Treated my mates car and its never come back.

Ok thanks for the advice, I'll have a look at that stuff. They only way I've found to get it completely off in the past, is to wet flat the paint (what I did this time too) them polish it back. If its starts to come back I'll give that stuff a try...cheape than a respray!

[Matty]

Yep, that thing with the two blue spade connectors is the turbo heat shield sensor that the anti-perc fan uses (and yes it's just a thermal switch). Since you have no heat shield (and most don't), it has nowhere to mount to, so it just hangs about.

You have three choices with it. Either remove it (a lot of people just remove the entire perc-fan and gubbins), fit a heat shield (and fit the sensor to it), or tie-wrap the sensor in a position that is close to the turbo.

I'd probably go with the first option but keep all the parts.

The plan is to make my own heat shield. Has anyone got a good picture of where they clamp to?

[J8TRO]

Ahhh Iron x, THE worst smelling thing on the planet. Fact.

Yeah, TBF it bloody stinks.

[Matty]

I've decided to clean up the air filter box whilst its out, looks tatty. As did a few other brackets so I decided to clean them up too.

I've also been trying to remove the air box mount and IC mount bracket, is there any way to get to the back of the studs/captive bolts as they are in a box section? They are very rusty, I've been putting penetration fluid on them for the past few days, but it only seems to be freeing up the stud and not the nut...heating it up is an option, but Im a bit worried about scorching the paint.

The speedo cable all looks to be intact, what's the best way to test if the sensor is working? Multimeter on the wires to test for pulsed signal whilst driving? Lol EDIT: found the answer.



All cleaned up, ready for paint.

[bood]

Great looking car. Good work so far

[Mr Raider]

Coming along nicely, good to see ya getting stuck in

[Matty]

Thanks for the comments. I'm just getting the bits done i can at he moment until my clutch cable and other parts arrive.

Anyways some completed parts.



I machined up some stainless washers for the front wiper grommets, as you can see the o,d ones rusted and stained the paint. The paint cleaned up ok, but I didn't want it to happen again.

[Matty]

I've managed to get a bit more done today, but I have also managed to snap the front IC mount bolt that goes into the front crossmember. Has anyone got a good way to remove the captive nuts without destroying the panel? I was going to try and drill out the bolt, but then i noticed that they were captive nuts, and thought about replacing the nut.

These things.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/M4-M5-M6-M...item2a322f0972

[Matty]

Dashboard is near enough out now, took just over an hour and wasn't as bad as I'd thought it would be. Just the white plug on the wiring harness on the passenger footwell stopping it coming fully out now. My battery tray is passed it's best, and rheostat not working, so thought I may aswell take it out and swap the battery clamp bracket round, so the nuts are in the engine bay and do the rheostat too. I may do the heater matrix, but it look pretty good condition to be honest.

Ive decided to make a stainless battery tray for it, as I want something that'll last.

[Mr Raider]

Its nearly out fella, definitely change the heater matrix whilst its out as a lot easier when dash is out, wouldnt want it to start leaking in a months time for the sake of £30

[Matty]

That's what I was thinking.

Well the dash was fully removed today and then I found something that looked....lets put it not so good!

When it bought the car, I was told that it had a new sill on the passenger side, I could see that it had been welded etc... But looked decent from the outside, but they didn't bother removing the rot before patching it up.

The outside, looked reasonable.





Inside not soo good!

[Matty]

After about 4 hours of blood shead, shouting and swearing at the car, the angle grinder, the cat. Lol it hasn't cleaned up too bad once the old rot was removed. I just don't understand the logic in leaving the old metal in place and plating over the top.

[Mr Raider]

Exactly what were they thinking!

Good work, glad you got it sorted fella, drivers side ok or been replaced?

[Matty]

Fortunately the drivers side is good. I'm just going to finish cleaning up this side, rust treat it, seam seal it, and paint it.

Next summer I plan to tackle a few areas around the bumper mounts and headlights, and I'll have another dig around. I need it on the road in 3 weeks as its going to be my daily. I know if take too much more off I'll end up stripping it bare, which defeats the object of having a car to drive. Lol

Both my other cars are fully restored, and you forget how bad it is working with rusty old seized bolts and past "repairs" that catch you out.

[sean5gtt]

That's what I was thinking.

Well the dash was fully removed today and then I found something that looked....lets put it not so good!

When it bought the car, I was told that it had a new sill on the passenger side, I could see that it had been welded etc... But looked decent from the outside, but they didn't bother removing the rot before patching it up.

The outside, looked reasonable.





Inside not soo good!

You could buy my mint floor out of r5 Monaco as outer panels and sills was rusty or dents but the floor from firewall to boot floor like new and no rust/rot 👍

[Matty]

Well my bits arrived today. old heate matrix out, new one ready to go in.

[Matty]

Well dashboard is near enough back in, although I have a couple of plugs that I don't know where they go? Can someone help me out with where these two plugs go?

This one is on the drivers side.



This one near the ash tray too, with yellow, black and blue wires.

[Matty]

Well I had a few good results today. found where the missing plugs go, one was tucked right inside the dash by the pedals for rear harness, other on heater switch loom. I now have a fully working heater fan...with 3 speeds (mod cons). I also managed to get my interior light working. Looks like the ariel had leaked at some point, as the circuit board was green, and main terminal was rotten away. I may need another plug in the long term, but I've managed to reposition the connection on the plug to work for now. I'm using those LED festoon bulbs, they seems to give nice white light....quality is something that needs to be addressed though. 5 out of the 10 I bought don't work.

Central locking now works, on both sides too...but I seemed to of lost the bloody internal door button somewhere.

One step closer to standard, just awaiting yellow foggys now.

[markg]

5 out of the 10 I bought don't work

You probably already know this but I believe these bulbs only work one way round.