well done pal sorry not been on the blower b4 just been up to my eyes in it....will take time out soon for a chat
well done pal sorry not been on the blower b4 just been up to my eyes in it....will take time out soon for a chat
stage 2 done just waiting for pod next month fingers crossed video should be on soon
Good luck buddy.
better late than never
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JZZYjJjudk
Devils advocate here , what are peoples views on gas usage and the 1/4 mile leader board rankings seeing as we have 0.01 splitting the top 2 RTOC boys .One on gas , one not .
Discuss
everyone will have a different opinion on this one, it would make for a good debate
My 2p, and the way I see it is that if you want to go much faster than that sort of time you WILL need nitrous.
It's possible to build a non nitrous motor like Stu did and make that time as Stu has proven. That is really impressive. I think even with the EFI we'd have been hard pressed to do what Stu did.
But, as I'm sure Stu will tell you, it is almost imposible to make any more power than that though. With glenn's from the off it was always going to be a nitrous motor, with a goal of going much quicker than 11.4, so everyhing about it was put in place to make the best use of nitrous and in larger doses than it has now. With nitrous it shouldn't be too hard to go quite a bit faster still, to get up there with gianni. If we had built a high performance non nitrous motor then we'd be tearing the engine to bits right about now wishing we'd have built a nitrous motor from the start. It's all part of the master plan *lol*
it's all good fun which ever way you go, and none of it should be taken too seriously
What are the main differences as far as engine build goes ? Does it work better on a particular design or layout ? Would a lazy old V6 respond well ?
there's not loads of changes but as far as nos on yours son depends just how far you have tuned yours ie how much to the limit it is but any motor out there will accept 50 bhp of gas but mine was built with 300 bhp of gas inmind so a little more thought was required in how to get the nos out. getting it in no problem
yours would respond really well to nos as the bmw 8 series in the video is running 150 bhp of nos and the chap was loving it
nitrous changes a lot of things! essentially there is a lot more exhaust gas to deal with so exhaust valves, exhaust ports, turbine sizing and wastegate all need thinking about. compression ratio gets a lot more critical too. it's really hard to put a lot of gas into a motor with a c/r that is too high without having to overly compromise on ignition timing, which directly effects EGT and the likelyhood of other nasty stuff happening in the chamber. Like most tuning though you can only guess the starting points, it's down to trial and error in the end. Like recently we discovered that glenn's motor responds to more boost better than it responds to more gas. That was a bit un-expected so we just have to roll with it and see what happens.
I miss NOS days with the old GT
Im Not racing but should be there if weather is good for the day out..
Answers one of my questions as I was thinking of nitrous on my engine, I know the comp is fairly high being an MSM build & I had already thought I'd need to use some sort of aftermarket ecu for timing..hmmm, maybe see what it will do off the bottle 1st & then maybe look int oforged pistons & a slightly modded c/r...
All I know is I'm itching to get back to pod
how do these volvo lumps respond to a bit of nos?
I know it's all in the set up, but having higher comp isn't going to help & I'm wondering if the standard ecu (if you can call it that ) will have enough retard when using gas.
It's definatly something I have been looking into & reading up about... I'm trying not to be spoon fed about this but it could end up costly if I don't get a few pointers from people so am tring to gain as much info as poss.
Yeah I thought the high comp would cause probs from what I've read up on Rob... The way I was hoping to get round it was with aftermarket ign ecu bud, you think it's worth a shot ?
I may just see what it does without gas & then lower the comp... I may have to go on a diet to get into the 11's though
OK You see this is where my car was different... My old car ran flat top pistons, and at a guess with 23psi boost i couldnt run much more than 35hp-40hp tops @ 4 deg retard and i was on limit just before det.. 99 ron fuel..
I think the thermodynamics involved with this particular argument are a bit beyond the scope of this thread but in basic terms the no.1 rule is to keep your ignition timing somewhere close to optimal even if it means sacrificing some compression to do it. It's especially important in a highly stressed and compact engine like the c1j where stuff can go wrong quickly if things arn't happy.
steve, if you want to stick with pump octane then you will need to lower that c/r for sure.
Yeah, I'm coming round to that idea Chris, I have no idea where to get higher octane fuel anyway..lol.
When James ran the VNT @ 23psi manifold the TDC was fully retarded, he moved it to standard & it popped the gasket right away... I think we can safely say the gas won't help that
Det-cans at the ready me thinks..
can you use that octane booster that you can buy in in a can. is that any good?
would be nice.
Gas V Boost...
In my opinion, my old motor would have responded to a larger turbine housing if I were to persevere with gas. The extra exhaust volume could not be dealt with (i am guessing a little as didnt test any other housings) and as my gas went straight into the inlet manifold the carb did not further restrict...
I didnt want to increase the housing for a number of reasons but mainly due to gearing as running only 3 gears means you need a large torque band, narrowing the torque band would have meant using 4 gears and due to selections available would mean potentially a non gt box.
My intention was always to stick with the basic set up as Renault intended and for the record it was basically the following.
Std crank, balanced
Std rods, balanced
Forged pistons, similar to standard but with beter oil return, lower skirt, increased squish band but dished not domed.
Std valves on 3 angle seats
Std head, altered chambers and well machined (not huge) ports
Std ex and inlet manifolds
Std carb re-jetted, 27.5mm venturi
different cam with vernier
3 extra engine breathers
std distributer, leads, ecu and ignition timing
i found through years of trying and testing that gains are in the finer detail, cam timing, exhaust housing sizing, temperature control etc
I think given more time, my engine would benefit from gas but that i had found the limits of the gearing and trying to hold the transmission together, I also found that my engine responded better to boost than gas and that maybe my next step should have been a better ignition map/bespoke ECU, oh and steel rods might have helped...
VAG gearbox gives you more options also...
A 10 second C1J, I would love to see!
Incidentally, has anyone seen my old car, seems to have dissapeared?!?
I havn't seen it about Stu I expected to see it at pod this year, or National day or something.
It is a shame, it will be a very strange car on the road as it was a big boost set up, I found it almost impossible to drive on even the best roads...
Good luck
new times on saterday at pod 11.20 and 11.28