how to write asking for a pay rise??

[djinuk]

Ok.. hes stuation, i was taken on by a roof tile manufactuer company just over 3 years ago, i was taken on with no experiance on the basis that after 6 months i would be taken on fully with a pay rise etc.. I had a review after 6 months , told i was doing amazing but due to current climate didnt get the pay rise, aroudn 6 months on i did get a pay rise but only a very small one added onto my less than great salary.

3 years on im in a position, we have taken on many more staff, 2 of which are in my department and i have trained, saying this there pretty crap, time keeping/attitude is terrible and im still left carrying 70% of the work load... What i did find is they started on a salary of around 40% more than my own, they do have hnd's however no previous experiance etc...

The company is now spending cash left right and centre, im doing a hell of a lot of work and taking on additional responsibilites left right and centre.. I have to attend work 30 mins early to keep on top of it as the others are usually around 30 mins late..

now the break through was, one of the members who i trained is actually leaving which means once again pressure will be on me to again train somebody else to do the job role..

I feel im in a good position currently to ask for a SIGNIFICANT payrise. Ive started putting an email together to send to my boss who is pretty new to the role, however i feel he has seen i do an awefull lot of un-noticied work for the company, just struggling what to put in it... should i mention i have an idea of others pay etc etc..


Any advice much appreciated as i understand there many members on here who probably have expeirnace of this.

[Bigfoot]

If your in the position of your important to the company and they cant cope without you, eg training up other staff and making sure its all going right. Put that in, look for other jobs in the area of same skill and and mention you have looked at other jobs and they are paying in the region of ...... and say that you would rather not leave but with current climate money is important to keep up with living expenses.

[Steven Leece]

New poster! (less than 10 posts)

I would not do it as an email, preferably you want to do it in person.....well thats what I think from experience.

Im not a big fan of emails for things like this.......you can ignore them, delete them etc...book a 10 min appointment with your boss

[BriC]

I agree with both the above

[djinuk]

thanks bigfoot , i appreciate your input..

I would say im in a key position within the department, its difficult to compare with other jobs as there isnt many jobs out there to compare to , only what this company is offering to new employee's..

I thought about putting somthing in there along the lines off, whilst i enjoy working for the company however unfortunatly im finding myself pushed into browsing other job prospects as im at a stage in my life where i wish to move on and my current salary wont allow for this.

[Robbo]

a short skirt high heels and lots of lipstick might help

[youngscottie]

emails a no no
if you cant ask the man face to face then you wont have his respect
have a heart to heart with the boss
explain your position and stress what you bring to the company
dont try and bully him into a wage rise yet give him a couple of weeks to chew it over

after that consider your future there cause there taking the piss
but in this climate they have the upper hand

[philg]

I agree with both the above

I agree with both the above

[djinuk]

indeed originally i was going to ask the boss for a 1 to 1, my reason for thinking for about putting it within a email was based on teh fact hes fairly new himself (4 months or so), and i know he wont be able to make any real actions there and then and i didnt want to really feel like i wasnt giving him time to think about what to say..

I will heed the advice though and put some notes together and speak face to face all the same. Your correct the company do have the upper hand, to be honest in a way i dont really blame the company to much.. My original boss migrated to australia very suddenly, then we had no boss for around 6 months, and only recently has steve took up the position, so i think in a way they havnt issued pay rises simply because they havnt had anybody able to observe the department.

[DaveMayGTT]

E-mail asking for a full appraisal, really you should have one yearly anyway to discuss how you feel about the job, how they feel about you and all being well its the best time to talk money.

[BriC]

I agree with both the above

Echo Echo Echo

[D4WNO]

Do it in person and clarify it in a letter (signed) after you have met with your Manager.

Do not mention other peoples pay scales - although annoying, they are irrelevant and it's about your pay, not theirs.

State exactly why you feel you deserve it, the extra responisiblities that you have taken on etc. Just big yourself up, you're the only one who will be honest and do it so don't be shy.

[Mart]

And unless you have a firm offer of a job on the table from another company, I wouldn't mention about looking around elsewhere in the vane hope of using that to obtain a pay rise. If they're looking to cut back on staff later down the line, your name will be top of the list, and if you haven't then got another job to fall back on...

By all means sell yourself to the boss, and what you bring to the company etc, but don't compare pay packets, work-loads, and cock girth.

[The new Bill J]

but don't compare pay packets, work-loads, and cock girth.

...unless your boss likes it up trap 2!

[J8TRO]

My opinion........

Dont e-mail, definately see your boss (Steve?) face to face. Do you get on with him? Does he have much say/clout? if not, have a word with him initially and then go above him.

Just be honest, tell him your feeling under valued. If he values you then he'll do something about it. If he/the company cant do anything about it, ask him when he/they can and get him to put something in writing to you as you need his commitment and you'll then have something to back it up. If he fails to honor his commitment when he says he will, re-visit your options at that time.

As said somewhere above, don't go telling them your looking at other jobs, BUT do look at other jobs. Go for an interview if you want. just to make sure your making the right decision.

The company i worked for folded before Christmas, all 65 of us were made redundant. I was gutted. However, i'd say 90% of us are already back in work, in equal or better positions, the fact were in a recession is irrelevent. If your good at your job, you'll be alright. If your not. you shouldnt be asking for the pay rise anyway

I'm sure knowing your outgoing nature and commitment to your interests apparent from this forum, your what i would consider a decent bloke and not a 9-5 money grabber.

[Rinzler]

New poster! (less than 10 posts)

If I may make a suggestion...

Dont ask for a payrise, ask you new manager if he would be happy to write you a reference for a new job your applying for next week or should you ask his boss / another since he only been in the job a few weeks. He'll kick it up the chain as he doesnt know you well.

So you send them a warning you leaving - and up to them to ask who / where you are going. Make up a good story...

Let us know how it goes..

[J8TRO]

Mate, no offence but that sounds like a terrible idea.

Prime example of lying with the potential of getting caught out.

Honesty is the best way in the world.

blag someone and prepare to look stupid.

[Duncan Grier]

It's kind of been covered but arrange a meeting with your boss to discuss the situation but be very careful with the bob does less and on 40% more angle or have been offered a job with another company.

All about building a profile and some background for him about your abilities and contribution to the company selling yourself in a professional manner.

Then listen to what he has to state before going back in to fast, whatever is agreed get it confirmed in writting as we have all been promised things in conversation but fails to happen and with no written proof is going to go nowhere.

Your boss is not going to care much is it comes across as a big moan so chose words carefully

Be positive and hope it works out for you - always a bitter pill to take when you find out staff are on more and not very good at the job lol. But affraid its life to a degree and it's all about playing the game

I know a little about a lot and a lot about a little but do just fine carreer wise

DG

[Tony Walker]

Nothing more to add but good luck

[J8TRO]

How did you get on with the above buddy? just wondering

[djinuk]

ah i forgot all about this.. Wel i spoke to the boss taking into consideration all that was said in this thread..

I covered my thoughts what i felt ,etc.. My boss pretty much confirmed that he felt me (and a colleque) who has been there for a while were very much undervalued pretty much because we just get on with it. Hes speaking to his senior about having my pay reviewed and i have a perfomance review at the start of march to better access targets aswell as further pay rises etc.

so all in all it went well, however it was very much "we plan, in future etc etc".. We also offer a lot of jobs internally (sales reps, training staff, etc etc) and fortunatly my position within technical has landed me in good step to pretty much be able to pic up any other job here and do it (with a small about of bespoke training for that positon) , therefore in my own mind i have decided that i will soon be applying internally for a position as either a sales rep or within the research dept as i feel this will be for the best. We also have a contact centre here , (large open plan office with about 30 women and 5 guys) , whom take orders and speak to us for technical advice, its a very easy position with easy hours and i imagine pretty mind numbing.. however the starting wage in there is actually more than im on currently even after a 1k pay rise i recieved last year.. therefore i thought about even applying internally to work in there.

[djinuk]

small update on this.. We currently require another person within our team to do the same job as me as the previous has now moved onto to a sales roll..

Me being me, decided to search the net finding the advert for this position (he exact same position as myself) .

the starting wage for this position is 40% more than my current wage..

Now although my boss has already said he will bring this up and see what he can do, i dropped him a pleasant email pretty much reading the following.


Hi s****

Just a brief one - came across this last night, following our recent discussion regards development and pay within my employment I feel this confirms the points I raised.

(website link)



I guess really that was just my extra bit so hopefully they dont try to fob me off with a measley few quid.

[clee]

Apply for the new position

[James5]

Apply for the new position

Was just thinking the same myself

[djinuk]

well i actually thought that but im not sure if they would just see it as a piss take on that degree.. wanted to try to keep it strictly professional.. besdides the new job position only lists about 50% of my responsibilites, id only have to work half days to fulfill it!

[TrixNFlix]

Sounds like they are taking the piss out of you. Apply for the new position.

[clee]

I'd apply to make just that point .I can't see you pissing them off .

[djinuk]

well what a piss take.. today ive had an envelope .. pay rise.. 1k.. stil 7k, under the lowest starting wage in here, and 10k under the higher wage for somebody experianced (which i would consider i am) .

Looks like i best get looking for a new job as its the only way ill get paid anymore, shame really.

[IANMM]

guess its better than a 0k pay rise........can you appeal?

[James5]

That is a bit of a piss take but better than nothing. Did you apply for the other role?

[djinuk]

nah i feel its more of a ..

Thanks for pointing out the obvious fact we are paying you far less than most others, dispite the fact you train them and are better than 90%..

however rather than pay you fairly on equiv or more than them, we will try you again at 1k and see if you shut up.!

[djinuk]

That is a bit of a piss take but better than nothing. Did you apply for the other role?

the other role being the same role as me .. i will be , although im applying externally to other jobs instead, i think i will have best bet of getting a fair payrise once a foots out the door.

[IANMM]

i would speak to ACAS as im sure there breaking a few employment laws

[djinuk]

im sure they could get out of it by just saying somthing like.. you dont have a degree unlike the others, however the job advert dosent mention any requirements for degree's

[IANMM]

well there the experts mate in my eyes its worth a chat and they will tell you exactly what they can and cant do legally.....

[djinuk]

indeed its gota be worth the call i feel, thanks for that.

Bit of a downer really, im now of the opinion the quickest way up the chain of pay is not through pay rises but actually thought job hopping!

[J8TRO]

indeed its gota be worth the call i feel, thanks for that.

Bit of a downer really, im now of the opinion the quickest way up the chain of pay is not through pay rises but actually thought job hopping!

Unless your in the right company (which it sounds like your not) i would totally agree with your statement. You gave them the chance to act accordingly, they didnt take it. Good luck mate.

Oh regarding the degree issue, i think thats bollocks, the degree just gets you in the door, if you can do the job its far more important. I've worked with people with about 3 degree's and they were useless. That's why a probation period of 3 months on any job is invaluable. its long enough to figure out if they can do what they say they can.

[djinuk]

indeed, we have a certain somebody with a degree who is uselesssss, she refuses to do work as she belives herself to be far to qualified, complete useless, whats more anoying is i know shes on far more cash then myself, and she really is a dog**** useless bag of spanners.

[D4WNO]

That really sucks, I'd be looking for a new job straight away.

When being offered another role elsewhere you could use the old bargaining tool to try and get more money where you are now...but would you really want to? They obviously aren't a good company to work for so just walk and say goodbye

[djinuk]

as silly as it sounds they are actually a very good company, investing in people etc etc.. however i kind of blame myself for just getting on with the job and staying quiet, it seems now they probably feel ill be happy for anything and wont kick up a fuss, hence they offered a measley wage rise just to shut me up.

I do however have a performance review coming up soon whereby i have a company of the job advert for the new starter.. its at this time ill be saying what do i need to do to get that bottom line figure... will be interesting to see what they say.

[James5]

indeed, we have a certain somebody with a degree who is uselesssss, she refuses to do work as she belives herself to be far to qualified, complete useless, whats more anoying is i know shes on far more cash then myself, and she really is a dog**** useless bag of spanners.

Is she fit though

[djinuk]

haha no mate.. shes about 20 stone, tingy ginger and does weight lifting,.. has a **** attitude, tells everybody shes not a social person, rides v twin motorbikes, and generally is everything you wudnt want in a female partner..

yuk

[James5]

haha no mate.. shes about 20 stone, tingy ginger and does weight lifting,.. has a **** attitude, tells everybody shes not a social person, rides v twin motorbikes, and generally is everything you wudnt want in a female partner..

yuk

Unless your a lesbian whom like there birds to look quiet manly or desperate like JRP


Sorry of topic, As you say think you need to apply for other jobs elsewhere, £1k is a pretty **** pay rise and will barely be noticed in your monthly pay packet. Get your CV out there you are bound to get something better.

[JRP]

Unless your a lesbian whom like there birds to look quiet manly or desperate like JRP


Sorry of topic, As you say think you need to apply for other jobs elsewhere, £1k is a pretty **** pay rise and will barely be noticed in your monthly pay packet. Get your CV out there you are bound to get something better.

Here here thats fecking hillarious cheered my flu ridden self up nothing like a good bit of verble from friends

[J8TRO]

Mate. time to be honest with them. Let them know you feel offended by there offer. Thats what I would do, but its your call. You still need to work there until something else comes along if they take it the wrong way.

I feel for you, its a **** position to be in. Me, i'd look for another job. Whatever you do, dont back off and be useless at work, it will be worth it so you can be happy knowing when you leave they will realise what they lost.

[philg]

I agree with the comments above, just stick in keep you nose clean and look for another job. You may well find when you hand in your notice, they may recognise your importance and match your salary accordingly.

Hope you get it sorted out.

[djinuk]

appreciate the comments.

I have a performance review coming up next week, it is here i will ask why my pays so much lower than the starting wage of newbies..

I wont kick up to much fuss as i dont feel its worth teh agro, afterall who wants a pay rise if you have to fight so much for it. Im going to apply elsewhere but selectivily rather than rush into another job..

Badtimes,

[djinuk]

bit of an update on this..

I took the 1k payrise, and have since been exploring other avenues..

Area sales managers are a key role within the company im in..

they earn 60% more than myself, and also ahve £600 a month towards company car, have bupa etc etc.. so basically a very nice position to be in..

Currently the only thing going against me for doing that position is a lack of customer servcies experiance..




so here it goes, .. IVe applied for a customer services position which i hope ive smashed in my interview yesterday.. From what i heard its probably going to be a bit full boring and a lot of paper smashing compared to my current role, aswell as being less flexible and generally just a bit crap.. however .. it should put me in a far better standing to apply to an area sales manager position when theycome up... now heres the funny parts.. starting wage for customer services is 3.1k more than im on !!!.. so it even reaps a pay rise.. crazy really.. but hey..

Im also going to speak to the director to let him know my end goal of an ASM..

now lets hope i get the customer services role, and get to where a little headset.



Oh i also spoke my a manager (not my manager as he wasnt a great help, and i feel i got a far better bit of info.

He said the reason we are paid low is because our technical skills are very niche and are hard to transfer to another job.. so basically its difficult for us to move., whereas customerservices, sales, marketing etc are far broader etc.. he also said i could get the company to push me towards a degree which would hold a pay rise at the end, however until that i would have to suffer low pay in technical.. He also confirms its a load of crap considering i can do the job off all 3 of our degree holding newbies in my sleep, but unfortunatly its the way the company operates..

I then spoke to him regarding sales and he pretty much confirmed its a very good way to go , and its the only way my 3.5 or so years of experiance wouldnt be worth nothing.

[Phoenix Autosport]

i think the young ones had the best idea when it comes to asking for money

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANquX0YHFhw

[Renault 5 GT Turbo]

I would set up another meeting with your manager but also invite his boss to the meeting.
The purpose of inviting your managers boss to the meeting is to ensure the message is getting through to him. Your boss is tasked at keeping his staff costs to a minimum and may not be communicating your points and request.

Go through your original job description and then highlight what you have done over the last 3.5 years outside of this to expand the role. This will clearly show what an integral part of the company you are.

Present to them similar jobs in the area offering a greater salary, raise the new starter issue again and ask them to explain why your role is not worth this. If they continue to come back to qualifications, focus on your experience and offer to take specific course modules that will satisfy their need. This will show confidence in your abilities and prove your commitment to them.

If they continue to ignore the points you make, tell them that you are a loyal, hard working, experienced, well established employee that enjoys working for the company, but you will have to consider your options.