rather than taking the other thread off topic, i've started a fresh one.
as the club shop seems pretty empty i thought i'd see what peoples opinions are of what they would like to see in the clucb shop, mainly items that are no longer availible, or that could be made in batches to reduce cost over bespoke items.
your thoughts?
..Originally Posted by Haz
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..i'll have a chat with clee about the basics. storage is not really and issue. if someone has good condition/new rare items then things would be easier to replicate and i would assume members would be willing to loan them, but maybe thats why things havent gone ahead in the past.
the side decals for example, i could have a set scanned, slightly modified and have a set in every oe colour in stock, and any other colour scheme in a few days, same for rear screen 'raider', rtoc large or small, cup car sets etc to get the ball rolling.
rather than side tracking the thread i may just start another thread regards all this once clee's got back to me
..the whole stickers thing does me in, was it Raj getting them made and selling them at £90 for something worth no more than £40.. he wouldn't do a group buy as he was making a load of profit.. he was in it to win it, which is fair enough but its a shame he didn't want to get a propper deal going.. rikki did them at 60 and in a group went down to 40..
that other chap had the phase 1's made didn't he? got his and then thats the end of it, which again is fair, but its a shame they didn't leave a contact number for the club so we could rattle off a batch of 30 for members a £40 a pop..
this stuff can be done, has been done but it all seems black market hush hush..
..In the past I have tried saying about group buys going into the club shop and what items I can get from work without much interest as more than likely due to size. I have sorted out with Mike brake compensators and valeo rads. And once the local rep is back from Valeo I will chase up on valeo clutches which I can get hold of 15+ next day without any problem so they say and trying to get them to sort out the yellow fog lights, I have sorted out pearl engine mounts to the club shop (no longer available) but other makes can source, gasket sets, fuel pumps and service kits, plus many of other items as and when I get asked for them. The company website is in its next stage of development which will then mean I can put special pricing for all items which will be available for all people within the club and with enough interest I could persuade the company to stock more of these items before they run out from the suppliers so easily available next day at competitive pricing. This is what im hoping to do for this club within this year, hopefully with feedback a sticker supplier which I keep chasing them up on, dont want to pay out money upfront on something they might not be able to do so have to wait till they get time for it
..so should the shop just stock tickets for events and leave the traders/induviduals to deal with organising replenishing things that are no longer availible? i think some of the bulk buys probably arent worth the club getting involved with but if there are items that are exclusive to club members, that cant be bought elsewhere or too costly to have just one bespoke item made, surely thats a good thing?
i've tried to arrange bulk buys in the past, but trying to get 10 members to pay up front for a product that they cant see never happens. if the club funds, if approved by the committee, are used to get the ball rolling to get a batch made then there's more chance of things actually materialising?
i'll start another thread, as this one is going off topic
sorry for those watching through the live window, just trying to keep comments in one place
I think more stickers should be available in the shop. Then cheap stuff like vac pipe which could be bought in bulk sold with a slight profit...
i definately think stickers would be worthwhile, especially if stocking every availible type.
with vac pipe, there's loads of cheap places on ebay, sold by the metre in every colour and as ian mentioned, by the time the club bought it in and paid postage the saving may work out the same price. possibly more renault turbo specific like silicone hose kits, braided brake lines, turbo feeds etc?
originaly posted in the other thread but probably more relevant here
with regards to the club shop it has been fantastic that parts like the dial overlays have been able to be reproduced and hats off to those who have got it this far but....
whilst i know its nice to have a not for proffit approach to keep prices down i recon it would be a lot more useful to people if it were run for a reasonable profit by someone like mike who could offer a lot more service and repair parts, and also used/refurbished parts, it would help him to sell his wares and help keep the club active as people would want to be part of it for the shop facility
maybe allow non members to purchase items but at a slightly higher price and put that money back into the clubs coffers
thoughts
Thanks for having some thoughts on this area and making suggestions.
The prices in the club shop as it is are making a profit. Members get a discount from those.
Would Mike want to do the RTOC stuff for free? Even a small fee per order might put some of the prices beyond the interest of members and from non members there'd nothing left to return to the club from the deal.
Mike already has a on-line shop. I don't expect he want to run a part of it for free as a service to RTOC members?..So perhaps he could operate the RTOC on-line shop as it is. Accept the shop emails, etc, deal with the ticket sales. Sell some of his own items from there with members discount.
There'd be some vested interests that clash with club members vested interests. Eg, the Raceland manifolds we did a that low low price. Sills, the carb kits, various other bits directly vie with Mike and other sellers who make their living from what they can make.
The members prices are at or near cost to us. So that would have to stop? We give new members and additional £5 off shop items.
I very much agree that it would be a good thing to have a professionally run RTOC shop jammed with loads of parts that members need. Might make it very easy for them to find what they want. But if we hire someone with their own shop, already doing all that for their own profit then they'd have to make less profit to sell out stuff for free + some kind of salary.
Miller was doing the side stickers years ago but they told him they couldn't be exactly copied due to the gradual colour change, or something.
I think Steve was planning some other stickers but then someone made and sold them at a large profit in the RTOC classifieds and eBay and there is a committee thread about it.
I think Mark Fish Motorsport was making and selling some stickers. There was a thread in Group Buys.
I'm not a stickers person and have never paid much attention to these and left it to others to make it happen and get them in the shop which alas never happened.
It a must point currently anyway unless Lee finds more time or the club find a new person to do it. Or some deal / arrangement is agreed upon with a company to run the shop for the RTOC.
I got the engine bay stickers done again as Sam Fish stopped them, I also got the Raider door badges a lot closer to the originals than the other replicas which are out. Also got asked by the Clio Williams club to get theirs replicated.
The first thing I'd like to see is someone who's going to be able/willing to run it! Re stock I think anything would be good really. Stuff we could buy in bulk would be good, ie oil/filters and general service items.
Reproduction items would be great also
I would love to see a reproduction under bonnet matting stocked
I guess from Ian's comments in the other thread that this GB is now dead. https://www.rtoc.org/boards/showthread.php?t=22620
I suspect that many on the list didn't buy the ebay items, may be worth looking at again as I can't see on ebay anymore
I would say that its more than likely that everyone who commented would still want one.
Due to the fact the thread was locked to stop people asking what was happening, rather than lack of interest.
The way forward for the shop I feel is to either merge it in with the likes of Mike in some way or set it up as a proper business selling far more stuff but will incur running costs .It will always be half arsed if left to someone doing it in their spare time .
Space is another issue with any stock we decide to hold .I now have more space having rented a unit and the office area is not used at present .But ...that space does not come free
what happened to the headbolts? I was going to grab a set for stock at some point!
We sold out .
One of the problems atm is I need to restock on almost everything .Carb kits ,bolts etc .Clothing also but I've still got a few big boxes of odd size remnants and loads of fleeces .
I have no time atm and it's pointless restocking here if it's all got to be shipped to someone else .
why did sam stop them ???
Didn't he originally have to get a set for a customer nuts and bolts rebuild and to spread the cost/be a nice guy made them available as a one off to the club.
Im not sure, I seem to remember him saying that the costs have gone up a lot in producing them, the most cost is in the initial making of the stickers which is not cheap which on both occasions I have put my own money towards it and hope to get it back, likewise with the raider stickers even though that wasn't as high as the engine bay stickers.
Are you able to suggest how this could be done?
Commission based RTOC stock sales ?
We have two prices ,members and non so we could have two rates .The new ' SHOP ' could stock lots more stuff that isn't RTOC funded but offer a members discount etc .
Take the dial sets as an example ..we made 2k on overseas sales at full rate ( slight discount for bulk/free shipping ) Surely some of that profit could go as commission ?
So a % of the non member price as commission.
Would there be enough income generated to pay someone enough for them to do it? Would it be a part time role they did as part of their own business?
This shop would be in direct competition with Mike and CGB. Maybe the likes of Forge and Ktec use profit margin such that we could shave some off from their retail prices and still make a salary plus some for the club.
But I expect the sole traders are using less margin, would have lower overheads and be hard to compete with.
Would those of the few hundred RTOC members who preferred to use RTOC postal parts instead of GSF postal of their local shops, buy enough product to make sufficient profit to pay some one full time?
I don't know. Lee could you estimate?
People have suggested service kits. They would perhaps come from GSF. Could we post oil; probably to expensive?
One advantage the RTOC shop would have over an normal shop is that it would need to stock only a small variety of specific parts are needed to service only a few models of a similar cars, mostly with shared parts anyway.
I saw it as let someone like mike run it and add whatever products he has to the stock as well as our current stock and a few group buy items,
Now your looking to challenge gsf and ktec. Good luck
Only scan read this thread, so forgive me if its been said already.
On a personal note the club shop should try its best to source panels, as most mechanicals can be found fairly easily, its the tin worm that kills these things.
It's a nice idea but who's going to store and post it all.
No I think we'd get the dealer price from GSF, same as KTec and others do?
There was thread regarding sills at least. Then Mike ordered them from what might have been the only supplier, IIRC the same one we were looking at, and was stocking them.
I'm guessing someone with plenty of space and time on their hands?
Do know anyone like that? If so please put their name forward
If Lee is putting himself in the frame for this, then he said the space is now not too much of an issue and if he's being paid, then he'll be able to take the time from his other work.
To do anything on that sort of scale you need to have premises and pay someone .Not a full wage but it has to contribute something to cover time and expenditure .
I just don't see it as some of the above ideas. I think most would be happy to see it kept in house stocking pretty much what we had before but with expanded GB's, looking to reproduce more hard to find parts etc. From a personal pov space would be the biggest problem, would profits not cover rental of a small garage/unit local to the person taking over the running.
i dont think any members would cry about it, time is money and a service should be rewarded
I'm not looking to do it .Not my area .
I was just pointing out that if it was to become more than just a cupboards worth then costs have to be expected .
I sold my old/new stock genuine Renault sills to Mike for next to nothing and I think he may have had the last non OE ones aswell...
At that time I was getting dirt cheap sills from a place that seemed to have and endless supply, only because I was getting them for the chaps who race R5's.
I'm sure they can be found again?
Even a storage centre could store the Club shop stuff if no one wants to have it at rolling around at their place, that is of course if there were enough money in the RTOC coffers, and a club shop member who takes the role is more than capable of dealing with orders and stock....? No?
From what I have re-read, its sounding like the best option would be NO club shop?
looking at what has been mentioned on the other thread, and this, i think people are expecting too much from the club shop. personally, asking mike to do it is wrong (dont get me wrong, top bloke and who i'd order my bits from these days) but firstly he seems quite busy enough doing his own thing without taking on extra work for non profit so cant see him doing it anyway, but then if he did then would the club not appear biased to him as new members especially would assume he's the only place to get things from? ok, i realise a few members boycott cgb these days but there is other traders on here who stock/supply a large amount of parts who may feel that way, i would if i was still breaking and selling items.
secondly, if the club shop is offering items that are already availible then it is treading on toes of others that are all ready supplying them, after all its non/minimal profit so should work out cheaper than what's already out there.
i think its should be offering things we cant get, or things that are unique because if its all left for an existing company to sort out then that company gets all the trade, then cant be bothered with the shop as its non profit so closes it down then just sells then from their own site, and has the monoply??
back onto the side decals idea again, yes they have been suggested many times before as there was rumours of renault not being able to supply, or not offering both sides, or not in the full range of colours. and the price jumped from a set to the same price per side and then looks like its doubled again. yes ricki used to offer them at a very good price but they were't replicas, as with some of the other stickers. good quality but not the same, his own version as they were done from scratch, the cost imo reflects the amount of time spent or the equipment used to get the detail right.
i'm going to speak to a company i've used for ages in the morning regarding these as they offer to scan the original, printing onto clear vinyl so will look exactly the same colour/effect/size bar a very minor detail for copyrighting purposes. all i'll need is an original to scan in. same goes for any other sticker on the car, under bonnet, renault for life, elf etc along with cup car graphic sets, raider stickers, rtoc front screen, rear and side window logos and will create any other desire logos. i'll be enquiring about rtoc number plates and other options. key rings, mugs, pens, mouse mats, t shirts, polo shirts, fleeces etc hopefully all bases are covered from one supplier. i know there is a supplier already but not directly a members so worth comparing prices.
i can look into other things that arent already being supplied via trader or member but one thing at a time until the ball is rolling on each
regards other stock though, as great as it is for members to source things for the club shop, if they arent making profit along the way, i think that the shop should deal directly with the source so that re ordering etc runs more smoothly (i dont know how its done now?) although the member may not get their cut on repetitive batches each time they should feel they are doing their bit for the club and will benifit from other items availible via other members
or is it just easier to leave this for the traders to sort out??
Good darts Haz
As for a lot of the parts which aren't common but still available from suppliers normally traders like Mike can not deal direct to them he will have to go through a stockist which will then put their margin on to the sale, plus a stockist will have a lot more buying power to get the price down. Group buys of the more expensive items will also bring the price of them down but for example with spark plugs buying bulk in a lot of spark plugs we will with we only get 10% off the plug but need to purchase normally 200 plugs of the same type, likewise wiper blades we buy in a pallet load, I think its 1200 wiper blades to a pallet but get a lot of discount for those. Halfords charge crazy money for their wiper blades.
As for other items can deal with suppliers like Sealey and draper so could even do group buys on tools needed to work on the car if needed or even tents which have found out Draper do sell
If people make a bit of a list, i can see what prices i can get parts for, we spend thousands with euro each month and get really good discounts.
That's how I and Lee do it. Mostly me that buys the stuff. I pay for it anyway, apart from packaging materials that Lee buys, the clothing company was sourced by someone, I forget now who, sorry to that personbut the quality seemed good this time compared to before.
We did buy a couple of sets of items from Bigfoot and Lee bought an internet job lot at some point. Lee designed and had made the towing eye covers.
The carb kits come from as high up and we can get them, Webcon wouldn't deal direct. Lee sourced the two non Webber O rings.
I specified the design and materials and got the Volvo bolts made and supplied direct from a manufacturer. The Unbrako 5GTT ones came from them too, cheaper than anywhere else, and combined shipping.
The Orange Dials come direct from the manufacturer. I deal with them direct.
This was the problem with getting some of the nice parts Shakal sells into the RTOC shop. I wanted to re-stock direct from the suppler and he didn't want me to.
With the Raceland exhaust manifolds Lee followed through with the lead already made and bought from the eBay seller in Europe. I would have preferred if we'd got them direct so it left us with a good footing to buy more direct. I think we viewed that as a one off though due to the storage space required to keep a bunch on Lees 'shelf'.
Did you want to see if I can get from Webcon, we can deal direct to them. Dont spend much with them but have dealt with them for around 4 years or so.
Got some Pagid front discs today about £23 for the pair. just as a for instance of the discount we get.They come painted too which is a bonus, so they dont corrode inside.
Last edited by Tony Walker; 06-09-2012 at 21:33.
Thats not a bad price, cheapest set really can do is just over £18 inc vat depends on margins which companies make but brake discs are not that expensive for the 5
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