Where did you get your cooler made? Or where did you source the core?
Everything to do with Secan on the web just leads back to £8000 Porsche race coolers...
Where did you get your cooler made? Or where did you source the core?
Everything to do with Secan on the web just leads back to £8000 Porsche race coolers...
I came across a surplus Focus WRC core. I think all their stuff is designed for the application, I know they were very helpful in designing a cooler for a friends sports car, but as you say, that help came at a premium price.Originally Posted by Lewis
prob a silly suggestion, but what about a Co2 spray onto the cooler? i know that it will run out etc, but may help keep the temp lower if used whenever temp gets high
If your intercooler is good enough, you shouldn't need any ''add-on tuning''.
other option is loose the ACT gauge, out of sight, out of mind...
Supersonic was using the Forge universal fit which I think uses the Alutec cores glued in a ropey way to the fins, and whilst lapping a track, I forget which, he was seeing 125°C before the cooler and 40°C after it.
Of course he was doing high speed. So that must help.
And, IIRC, the cooler was mounted behind the grill.
Mike Spencer had the pace CC on his 12.2 second car set up. We were seeing 94°C after that cooler!
We couldn't really believe it and I and he checked the gauge many times. It was always correct.
With his big Radtech cooler, the temps at full tilt didn't go much above 40°C and often were below. At low speed running the cooler would be at maybe 20°C then when planting the loud pedal they would initially drop downwards to maybe 15°C for a while!
my ex's one would only see about 60deg with the c/c pump switched off on a PWR c/c and VNT, on a normal day (not hot or cold) charge temps at carb top would be 20deg.... and thats on an ian s gauge
right more testing results guys this time pre cooler
ambient temp 10'c
boost 20 psi
2.5k rpm 3rd 35'c normal driving off boost
7k rpm 3rd 272'c wot
2.5k rpm 4th 35'c normal driving off boost
7k rpm 4th 285'c wot
after cooler max i have seen so far is 92 'c but mainly 70's so im taking 200 or so deg out of the charge, ive been looking at other tests of pre intercooler temps and they are seeing 145 deg on a std stock setup.
should my temps from the turbo be this high? if not please advice
with thanks hammy
right more testing results guys this time pre cooler
ambient temp 10'c
boost 20 psi
2.5k rpm 3rd 35'c normal driving off boost
7k rpm 3rd 272'c wot
2.5k rpm 4th 35'c normal driving off boost
7k rpm 4th 285'c wot
after cooler max i have seen so far is 92 'c but mainly 70's so im taking 200 or so deg out of the charge, ive been looking at other tests of pre intercooler temps and they are seeing 145 deg on a std stock setup.
should my temps from the turbo be this high? if not please advice
with thanks hammy
This seems a little high to me.
Wonder what the pro's online here think
Ooh err, that's pushing the limit for that probe type.7k rpm 3rd 272'c wot
7k rpm 4th 285'c wot
I'd recommend not doing that too many times.
IIRC, the thermocouple wires sheathing is rated to about 250°C. I think the PTFE jacket I used is rated to about 250°C also.
What will happen? Not sure. Perhaps the plastic may go a bit floppy and take a set at a new shape? Worse case would be that it will either melt and run off or evaporate off.
hammy here not andy, yeah ian i know just didnt expect as high as that , it has gone a little limp hahahah, no more pre cooler attemps today, i just cant believe the readings, also been trying in the air filter pipe, we hit 174 my filter has a direct cold feed all around it and is behind headlamp not in the air box at the mo though.
its sitting at 16 while cruising , all i can think is its sucking in half the engine bay too or heat is traveliing out of the front of the turbo and upto the probe some how , although im a good 5-6 inches infront of it ?
??????
I'm trying to imagine any way that it could be a gauge error, but can't!
I assume that your earth wire is making a good earth? But even if it was a bit shady, I think the thermocouple voltage would be the same mV above that earth. The voltmeter would also be measuring the mV presented to it at the same earth reference that the thermocouple chip was at, so I'd guess, would still show the correct reading.
I have seen moisture on the voltmeter electronics causing a fluctuation in reading on some of the meters, but not all. I don't know why.
How hot is it behind your alu panel that the meter in mounted in? Have you blanked off the air intake from the engine bay now that you've cut away the scuttle panel? Is the black box, that contains the thermocouple chip, at ambient temp or is that in a very hot area? According to the data sheet, if that chip goes over 50°C then it will affect the reading.
Does you unit have the ambient temp switch to show the temp of the chip?
in answer Ian
yes fan area is blocked as i run a different heater
no its in a very cold area i would say ambient at max
yes it has ambient switch that reads around 12 deg high of true ambient.
reading are smooth not irratic so unfortunatly dont doubt the readings, they start getting hot when i hit full boost and hold for a while after 6k they are at their worst.
Im starting to become so concerned ive been offered to test a pwr charge cooler on sat for ****s and giggles , if it works i may have to throw in the towel and just buy one but i dont really want one.
I also still have doubts about the trim of the comp housing may return it to adam for a bigger one
Perhaps the turbo is just spinning too fast to make that boost? And the compressor over heating the air?
So a larger compressor might make the same pressure for less spinning and less heat?
thats kinda what im thinking Ian, i may disconect my gizzmo boost controller and test too as the gain is set high on it and could maybe cause the unit to be overboosting?
In a word, no
No wonder you're struggling with getting a lower intake act!
I'd say you're outside the turbo's happy zone at that level of boost. Just for a test, what's the pre-'cooler temperature when ya at, say, 1bar boost?
play with this:right more testing results guys this time pre cooler
ambient temp 10'c
boost 20 psi
2.5k rpm 3rd 35'c normal driving off boost
7k rpm 3rd 272'c wot
2.5k rpm 4th 35'c normal driving off boost
7k rpm 4th 285'c wot
after cooler max i have seen so far is 92 'c but mainly 70's so im taking 200 or so deg out of the charge, ive been looking at other tests of pre intercooler temps and they are seeing 145 deg on a std stock setup.
should my temps from the turbo be this high? if not please advice
with thanks hammy
http://www.not2fast.com/turbo/glossary/turbo_calc.shtml
you need to measure boost at the turbo, and then you can work out compressor efficiency. Either way, it's either a measurement error, or bloody dreadful.
going to try at a lower boost pressure tommorow .
Andy i dont understand how to use the calculator , sorry im not that clued up. From memory with 26psi @ turbo i was showing 20 @ carb base .
I tried these settings and came out with 120 % efficiant? does this mean im past the effective map on the turbo please help
ok , more figures for you to laugh at.
At the amazing power of 8 psi woooooooooot , electronic controller removed i am getting charge temps of around 50-60 deg 'c .
so , next thing is to try another turbo on her and see what the hell that does
also im going to try and get another gauge tommorow but im sure this one is correct, we had it outside the car at one point on the windscreen as we though a electrical fault was causing it when i get higher revs, but it sat at 8 deg lmao
i love this car hahahah
Last edited by TNT!hammond; 02-10-2009 at 20:07.
in a 10C ambient, 8psi boost, and 60C charge temp gives a 78% compressor efficiency (excellent)
in a 10C ambient, 26psi boost, and 285C charge temp gives a 35% compressor efficiency (slit your throat and drop your still twitching corpse into a sewer)
Obviously, if you're sucking hot air into your turbo those numbers will be different.
thanks andrew , ill get my knife lmao,
in a nut shell then Mr cooke, are you thinking i need a new blower
I'd check 2 things first; are you getting enough air into your cold air box? (1psi of suck makes the turbo think it's boosting ~3psi more - if I've just worked it out right)thanks andrew , ill get my knife lmao,
in a nut shell then Mr cooke, are you thinking i need a new blower
Do you have any boost leaks? Test at 26psi.
what compressor are you running?
i tested my boost run to 3bar . no leaks , tred testing the vac pipes and found no leaks , only the manifold and carb are untested as i have no idea of how to do it,
last night i did run a silicone hose out of the grille like a snorcle , with no difference in results
oh comp housing is a .42 t3 housing with .60 trim
found an old tomcat turbo i have that has no shaft play also have a vnt here too that hasnt been adjusted since i last used it, think im going to give these a test over the weekend too . Thats after i do a leak test, but cant see me finding anything as boost hold fine and builds well even with no controller and just the actuator
Last edited by TNT!hammond; 02-10-2009 at 23:10.
update ,
fitted a t25 which is a tomcat core and front but with a .47 rear machined housing.
went to do a few runs but after only 2 it started raining, i can say the temps seem lower from the cooler on boost @ 18 psi than before but after around 5 k start climbing again at pace to around 70 'c , this is hot but better than 90 hahha.
going to do a few more test tommorow, unfortunatly i couldnt get another gauge and sensor to test the one i have so this may have to wait. I am also worried now that maybe i have high egt temps causing the turbo to heat up and transfering heat across.
Ill check my timing tommorow just to be sure im not running silly advance or something?
that's not going to happen.
Thanks Andy , at least thats off my mind
going to try and test the t25 tonight , just havent had the time or weather for it till now,ill let you know whats happening
Hammy , not bald Andy :P
Remember though the external ambient temp has been a lot cooler over the last few days.
well been out , its fing freezing outside and my act gauge hit 85 deg on my t25 at peak 19.6 psi, doesnt really improve when boost is lowered , where does this leave me?
going to have to wait for a bit to try a pwr core now
also deffo going to order another gauge as id like to make a adapter hose to measure before and after cooler temps & boost pre /after too , could a huge pressure drop cause trouble? im all out of ideas and enthusiasm thb hahaahah
19.6psi - Manifold or turbo?
sorry Mart , thats manifold , should state that really
im going to try and get some roller time as im struggling to see all that happening while trying to keep the car on a set course hahah, only problem is i will no doubt get different reading on the rollers.
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