Hi guys its hard finding threads on b18ft builds as I only have the iPhone.
Could you help out and let me know who's got threads and links?
Thanks for the help
Hi guys its hard finding threads on b18ft builds as I only have the iPhone.
Could you help out and let me know who's got threads and links?
Thanks for the help
https://www.rtoc.org/boards/showthread.php?t=19258
May help ya pal
Brilliant thanks
It can't be that easy surelyOriginally Posted by Andyturbo!
it seems that way from that thread but some how I can't see it lol
Or there is this
#2
davebem
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Re: Volvo 1.7 Turbo Mods
Theres some useful stuff on this website.
http://www.volvo-480-europe.org/index.php
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11-11-2008, 21:44 #3
n0rm
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Re: Volvo 1.7 Turbo Mods
heres an interesting read ive bookmarked from RTOC mate, there are a few pointers that may indeed help you along the way
1.7 turbo conversion
WHAT ENGINE?
Instead of buying those awful 1.7 renault engines and trying to put a turbo on them you should resort to something else - volvo 1.7 turbo engine commonly found in volvo 440/460/480. Contrary to popular belief, stated on various R5GTT boards, this is a RENAULT engine, you can actually find Renault markings on the block, which is absolutely identical to any F type engine Renault makes (those are 1.7 L in R5 GTE/GTX or other renaults, as a mater of fact 1.8/2.0 16V is also a F block). What was added in volvo is some low compression pistons, Garrett T2 (yes a T2!) turbo, and a complete set of trick Bosch LH jetronic fuel/ignition management. What is trick about it is the fact that it incorporates boost control but more about it later.
The engine develops only 120 HP, but that is with very little boost, probably 0.4 bar, and with a very restrictive cat/exhaust.
BUYING
Ok, the engines in 440/460/480 turbos are identical, and I suggest you find the best you can. If you are in a position to buy a good one from a 440 then I suggest you buy the gearbox too. The reason is simple, 440, in contrary to other 4xx volvos, and R5GTT, has a different gearing, which will not give you any more top speed, but the gears are stacked together a bit more, and 5th is a direct 1:1, which is much better if you like to drive fast somewhere else than on the motorway.
I actually bought both a gearbox and the engine from a 440 and can say that the box is a straight swap for a GTT one, while I somehow find the changing action much better, more precise.
Electronics
When buying make SURE that you get all the electronics, since there are two boxes, one for the fuel, other for the ignition. The ignition box has a small pipe to which vacuum/pressure from the intake manifold is connected.
The wiring loom usually looks like a a big tangled bunch of wires, something that no one can manage, but in reality it consists of 3 sets of wires, which are connected together by some plastic clips:
1. Wires for the lights and indicators - to be separated and thrown away
2. Bosch fuel/ignition wiring loom. Can be identified by two big connectors for the ECU's. Take it out carefully. It also has a bunch of relays which control the fuel pump and ignition.
3. Special wiring loom which is used for the turbo/injector cooling. Now, like GTT, a volvo turbo engine also has a fan which blows air onto the fuel injectors, but it also has a water pump that circulates water through the turbo, even when the engine is shut off (similar pump can be found on R19/Clio 16V). Those are controlled by two (or is it three?) sensors, which you can find under the turbo (on the water line), and screwed to the intake manifold. I took this off and threw it away, did the same thing with the water pump. The pump gives you an added bit of protection, but only if you are stupid enough to shut the engine off immediately after a hard run.
Exhaust
Apart from the exhaust manifold with the turbo attached, which I presume you will take with the engine, you should also take the turbo downpipe, which fits neatly in the GTT with no modifications, and is made to a much higher standard than anything you (or any "tuner") can make. It is also pretty hefty in diameter. If you want you can also take the catalytic converter, which hosts the lambda sensor.
I took the cat, but used a drill to take out the ceramic catalytic converter inside, so I ended with a empty box.
Intake
Make SURE, and I can not stress this enough, to get the airflow sensor. It is a hot wire type, and probably costs more new than you will pay for the whole engine. It is worth checking if the wire is broken, since it can happen, especially if the car was damaged in an frontal accident. Also worth checking is the rubber flexible pipe going from the sensor to the turbo, if broken it will give you headache. Mine was completely destroyed and I had to improvise. It also houses an recirculating type dump valve.
Misc
It is highly unusual to find an engine complete with the intercooler, since it will probably be damaged in the accident, but try to get as many coolant/intercooler hoses as possible, since you will find them useful later.
Ok, you just bought the engine, what is next?
Checking it out
First, open the cam belt cover and examine it or replace. F type engines have, besides the cam, oil pump driven from the belt also. Just above the pump drive you will find a 1/4 inch oil line going under the exhaust manifold to the turbo. This can sometimes crack also. I had to replace mine and did so with the engine in the car which was a pain. Do not buy the original item, but have it made out of a braided flexible teflon hose... much better.
WHAT TO MODIFY
Tuning
Ok, I guess you are not satisfied with 120 horses, so do something about it.
First of all, you do not need the CAT. You can just bolt it off or do what I did and drill the ceramic core out of it. The CAT also houses the lambda sensor, which you can just plug out (it will increase the consumption somewhat but will improve power/driveability). I kept the sensor, but just plug it in when I need to go to MOT.
volvo engine has a very weak wastegate, which is connected to the turbo housing by a little silicone line. On it, you will also find a little electromagnetic valve. This valve is used by ECU to control the boost. I did the following and am suggesting you to do the same: remove the boost control, and change the wastegate. You can not use the one found on the GTT, since there the turbo is turned the other way round, but should buy a normal T25 wastegate. I took mine from a big T25/32 turbo that I am using for my 1.8 16V. I have mine adjusted to 0.6 - 0.8 bar, which might not sound like much but is plenty.
One of the major problems with this volvo engine is that the ignition controler also has an overboost switch. Unlike the GTT, on which it was possible just to plug it out, on the volvo you can not tamper with it. The result is that with this ECU it is not possible to go above 0.9-1 bar.
T2 turbo on 1.7 engine is a bit small, I admit. It is actually a bit bigger than your standard T2 turbo found on the GTT. Tuners would probably call it a STAGE 1 hybrid . If you like your power immediately, and available from low on the rev range, the standard turbo is your best bet. I could see a bigger (T25) one... but I would have to change the electronics to cope with the increased boost. I am not thinking of that, since I have a 1.8 16V turbo waiting to go in.
PUTTING IT IN
Engine mounts
Ok folks, it might say volvo on the intake manifold but it is a normal Renault F type engine. So, the gearbox engine mounts fit, you just need to change the one engine mount that is found on the block. You need the complete mount, not just the rubber, since the metal part that bolts onto the block has a different bolt pattern.
If you want to use your old GTT gearbox you will have no problems, bolting pattern between the GTT engine and a F type one are very similar, and the GTT box has holes for both types. The only thing to chnage is a little metal guide, usually found pressed in the gearbox, around the bolt, near the right driveshaft. You just need to pull it out and place it in the hole nearby. Do not worry, you will see it.
Exhaust
As I said before. Make sure you get the downpipe. You can use it with or without the CAT body, you just need to have someone connect the exhaust. You can use your old GTT one or make a new one. Modifying the GTT one is a 10 minute job at your exhaust specialist nearby.
Do not use an restrictive exhaust. Standard R5GTT one is no good and will rob you of power. Aftermarket ones are ok for the most part.
I first made a side exit one, no silencers, and that one was FUN FUN FUN, but just too loud. Now I use a straight through pipe, 2 inch dia. with no silencers, which exits in the normal position. It is also a bit loud but much better than the side exit one.
Oil cooler
volvo engine uses a sandwich type oil cooler, with the engine coolant water passing trough. This is no good for two reasons: First, it does not do a very good job, and more importantly, the filter sits too high on the block and interferes with the radiator fan. For a while I actually could not install the fan...
I did the following: Use the block that is used on the standard GTT 1400 engine, mounted under the oil filter. It will fit the volvo engine perfectly. Either run the oil through the radiator like on the standard car, or install an external cooler (what I did). I like the cooler found on Opel (vauxhall) Kadett/Astra.
Engine cooling
First of all, remove that stupid electric water pump that you will find on the volvo engine. I is a nice idea but just complicates things. Also remove its wiring loom.
Connect the turbo to one of the water jackets coming out of the head. Water exiting the turbo should run directly to the pump. There is a large metal pipe running around the block in front. It also collects the water from the cabin heater. Do not worry about this, there are plenty of places to connect this.
Top cooling hose, going from the head to the cooler is not a problem, it is straight and not a problem to connect. The hose going to the pump is another story...
F type engines have their water pump positioned lower down on the block, and the pump intake is facing toward the gearbox, instead down as found on the standard 1.4 turbo engine (C type engine).
Additional complication for me, was the fact that I was using a R5 Diesel radiator which itself is much bigger than the standard item, and together with the intercooler covers the whole cars' front.
What I did is find a Renault 25 radiator, which has both intake and radiator exit positioned on the same side. I had to modify it, so that I can turn it upside down, so that the intake/exit sits closer to the gearbox. This gave me a direct line from the head to rad, and a nice, almost straight line, with only one L bend for the lower line. This was by far the biggest modification I had to make to make this engine work.
Intercooler
Now, I have not seen the original volvo intercooler, since it was damaged too much, so I can not speculate, but I used a normal GTT intercooler. I removed the thermo flap long before. Connecting the turbo and engine intake with the intercooler is best left to your creativity, I used a combination of Volvo and Renault hoses, and some pipes I made myself. One thing to watch out for is the first little silicone elbow used by Volvo on the turbine exit. It is a "samco" type rubber, and should definitely be used. Just make sure, with the engine out, that it is properly connected and use a strong clip so that it will not fall off. It is a pain to mount later on, and is difficult to identify a leak there.
This is about it... If you haven't taken your engine out before, let me remind you that this is best done by removing the front subframe. I actually changed the whole engine myself, with basic tools and some improvised lifting jack used lift the engine off the subframe. It took me a two days to exchange the engine, two more weeks to connect everything.... Not a big job if you have time.
What to expect
Ok, let me put it in this way: 0.6-0.7 bar boost, straight through exhaust, no air filter yet, The car spins its wheels through 1, 2, and if the roads are dirty, even 3rd. This is on A520 Yokohamas, 195/45 15. I did some acceleration tests, and while spinning wheels prevent me from posting a good 0-60 time, in high speed acceleration (50-70 and above) it is faster than Civic Type R (old 190 HP one) I could outrun Accord Type R's without problems. Even on standard gearbox, it will do 140 mph, and will get there VERY quickly. On one occasion, at that speed my rear spoiler flew off.
Best of all, I must have spent 600 pounds at most for the whole conversion.
if you ever need any in depth tuning advise just PM me mate, i had a highly tuned 480 lump in my RWD/mid engined R5GTT
Mine
Picking the lump up tomorrow off Marky marklooking forward to some b18ft fun..
Yeah right! That'll never happen!
Well I run 23psi on my daily 1.4 c1j so I'm always on the edge and paranoid. At least with a 1.7 and about 15-18psi I shouldn't be pushing it as hard plus no more carb issues. But in three yrs iv had the t2 the t25 the t28 cammed not cammed built and rebuilt engines I'm bored and need a change from the c1j so I will try the b18 and when I'm bored of that who knows
Paul your a c1j judas
Iv served my time with the c1j iv driven it daily for 3yrs time for a change.
The b18 is a great engine but don't expect it to be more reliable than a c1j. I could quite happily take an axe to mine at the moment while trying to figure out why it's not running right. 1bar is the most you want to run on a t2 turbo after having the scoff mod done on your ecu. Anything above this will start pinking but a bar should see 160-170 horses.
I've got a t28 on a tubular manifold, Saab red injectors, ep cam and after fitting adaptronic I'd like to see 230bhp at a safe boost pressure 18-19psi hopefully.
Ross
Oh buggerI think I would still be happy with 170bhp
T2 on mine, 1 bar and the car made 170hp 240torque
So pulls well with the t2 then? I'm really looking forward to the change and the torque figures seem very wellT2 on mine, 1 bar and the car made 170hp 240torque
So much so, that the spare t25/28 I have, has sat in the garage for 2 years
Dam I just sold a mint one.. T2s are easier to get should I need one but I'm hoping by turning the boost down it will last me longer than at 23psiSo much so, that the spare t25/28 I have, has sat in the garage for 2 years
Haz' car had a big t28 on it, wasn't massively laggy and went like **** off a shovel. T2 way to small imo
Bollicks, it all depends what your using it for. Yeah 1/4, or motorway blasts yeah ok. For the track, mine spools so fast and has loads of torque to pull you out of a corner. Lets face it your lucky if you can find a uk track with a straight that you can get much over 100 mph.
so you have tried a bigger turbo to compare then??
Dudes I'm going to my local factors for plugs leads dizzy and arm and a thermostat..
What year should I say? Volvo 480 turbo G plate? Is that the one?
Last edited by Nottswoody; 23-07-2013 at 18:55.
££70 for parts not too bad happy with that so far
Right 5s off the road time to get the b18 in.. Don't expect quick progress as the mrs is having a hard pregnancy and I work long shifts.. I now have all the parts needed with thanks to Marky mark and eBay
Question..
Is the biggest restriction the ecu? And what's all this stand alone stuff?
What I have is my t28
B18 engine with n/a cam
Lightened flywheel
My box
Green box clutch
T5 injectors & standard to get it up running
New alloy rad (china special but looks good)
And a few other bits in the pipe line.
What else could I do..
As in the film
I want the world and everything init!!
Ideas? Pros cons of the b18..
Suppose I'd better get this started then its been off te road two weeks but I haven't done anything. (Mrs is in and out of hospital) better crack on.. Got two hrs to myself as the mums got my lil one..
Thinking of painting my bay.. Would a run down then primer then rattle cans do the job? Obviously taking my time.. If china can doit surely I can I'm not after a show finish. What should I buy?
You could use halfords cans or something but it will be soft and wont last very long, I did it this way before it's worth using better paint if poss, something that will be harder. Next time I will use 2k paint
Last edited by robw; 08-09-2013 at 15:19.
Well just the engine mounts todo then she's out.. Suprisingly quick when your leavin everything on.. Out of time now so will be another day.. Noticed the t28 front has movement I am having it rebuilt anyway but is that the seals?
I might just stone chip the bay or is that too gash
I Stonechipped my bay, got carried away after doing everything else but even though its paintable I want to flat it back now but can't see it being a nice job really.I might just stone chip the bay or is that too gash
Depends what your looking to achieve from the bay? If its show and having it looking great then stonechop probably isnt for you lol
Not for show bud.. Mines just all scratched up.. I'm not for bonnet popping but while the engines out I though I might aswell do something with it.. Too tight to have it sprayed..
You could chip it which would be nice and easy then paint it after if you cant be arsed to prep the bay lol. But it would look like an inner wheel arch after
I sprayed mine myself mate do you have a compressor ? I wouldn't use stone chip personally
I can live with that
No bud nothing like that.. The 5s staying with me so I'm happy with the stone chip.. After all it won't make it go faster
So dudes while taking the bumper off iv noticed the part were the bolt holds the bumper is completely shot.. Can I buy this panel? Or is it make one up? It's actually flapping in the wind lol so while I'm doing the engine I want this doing. Or had anyone got one?gg
You can buy them mate quite easy to make also
Week off starts tomorrow.. C1j out and b18 in
Im starting mine at the begging of next month, so will be seeing how you get on with a watchful eye. Let us know how you get on.
I also have a b18 project that needs finishing but have to get my garage floor finished first. So hopefully couple weeks we can compare notes!
No probs guys I will update as much as i can I see no issues getting it in so far it will be the pipes and wireing that I need help with but I'm lucky to have a very good friend
So yesterday I started the b18 conversion.. C1j came out easily 2.5hrs this time
So I sent my t28 off to midland turbos and they said its a cossie front and 200sx rear and won't know if they can rebuild it till they open it up.. Thankfully the movement was up and down but not in and out so hopefully it won't be to messed up in there.. But that's what you get running 23psi on your daily driver
Next I swopped my green box clutch to the b18 as its only 6months old..
Then I found out that you need to take all the dowls out of the 5 gearbox and remove the dowls out of the b18 block as they don't match but the bolt holes do.. When fitting the gearbox take the tdc sensor off as it clashed with the water pipe on the block.. To get the tdc guard back on you will need to modify it a Little by grinding the holes away and keeping just a little of metal for the bolts to grip and hold.. I took off about 5mm and now fits nice.. Also I need to modify the flywheel guard as that dosnt fit nice but you will see what needs doing.
Everything else fits a treat so far..
Today will be chopping out the cross member for a massive ic thanks to Marky mark.. And then remove all the c1j parts out the bay. Aei and fpr etc etc rub the paint work down and a fellow member thundercat will be helping me today
Tell you what though my backs getting to old for this lifting engine **** lol I only have scaffold A frame so its bloody annoying having to keep putting wheels back on and lowering and pushing the car out the way on your own..
So today we cut out the cross member took out all the none needed items out te bay.. Got my turbo rebuilt from midland turbo for £318 which stung but needed doing. Tomorrow some welding needed for brackets to hold the huge ic in place. Then paint the engine bay.. If I get that done tomorrow me and thundercat will be happy.
All going well so far..
Sounds like good progress any pics :-)
sounds like your getting on well mate, are using ta gtx engine mountt or drilling out the standard one?
I only have the iPhone to upload and my photo bucket is locked.. I will do them towards the end of the week.. Im too poor for a pc/laptop and the mrs says I will just watch porn anyway..
From what I can see this block came off of a 5 so on the right hand bolt hole there's about 3 washes to space it.. I'm guessing its moved the angle so a standard mount will fit I'm hoping to have it in by the end of the week so will let you know if that works..
Guys what you think to rubbing the bay down with 800 grit then prima then red hammarite? Got to be worth a go? Works well on my rads in the house.. Not red obviously
800 will be far to fine for primer, is it rattle can primer or proper stuff?
Anything that comes out of wickes this morning
If its rattle can primer I would use 240-320, let it go off over night unless you can bake it, then flat that for top coat with 800 wet.
Good progress and advice
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