I prefer to call it voicing what is wanted by most members yet they don't shout up for being smacked down.
Bury your heads in the sand. Pretend the problem isn't there. Quality.
Printable View
I prefer to call it voicing what is wanted by most members yet they don't shout up for being smacked down.
Bury your heads in the sand. Pretend the problem isn't there. Quality.
There is no problem, apart from you.
There is an irony in your statement.Quote:
Originally Posted by car.crash
You are the very thing a club doesn't need. You don't nail your colours to the mast. You hover around arguments waiting to stick the boot in and you are critical of just about everything and everyone.
Grow up and formulate an argument rather than the throw away one liners of abuse that you seem to only be capable of.
Take a look in the mirror son, you're the epitome of the word problem with attitude like that.Quote:
Originally Posted by car.crash
What's up now Andy ?
:DQuote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
Title of the forum is wrong mate. Its inflammatory , and insulting.
Why couldnt it be called the forum that doesnt display on the live board.
subtext : contentious issues are held in here. Enter at your own risk.
and just to be really , really arguementative , some members DO want to see that threads occupy the live feed :eek:
I see... so you're just being a cheeky northerner again. :cooter:
Or as its known , correct .Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
:D
In yours & probably dave's 'collective' opinion... :wasntme:Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
Yawn...Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
Perhaps it should be renamed andy&dave forum.... :sad2:
Perhaps the Committee should be renamed "Elitist-never-wrong-we-will-silence-you-board"Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashy
:laugh:
At least Andy & Dave get a response from the Committee when they post :rolleyes:
I'll post it in here then........
OK, so because I messaged all of the people who showed some interest in Sangliers telling them that my future updates would not be posted on the RTOC but elsewhere I cannot now buy some parts for my car through the classifieds section??
Feels like a little bit of an over reaction to me.
So what exactly does my £15 Membership entitle me to now???
I await your response.
"Acrimonious whinging"
I thought it it showed a rare sense of rather dry humour.
:agree: :)
Too dry perhaps.
New poster! (less than 10 posts)
Hi
Just thought I'd pop my head in to the site and see what was happening.
So what 's the problem with you all. I thought we were on-line mates?
I'll quote this because I remember you asking a few days ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Steve - Raider
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Steve - Raider
I thought you were just in a temporary state of "purdah" whilst the situation was pondered. At least you still have a voice on here which is more than can be said for others on the other site.
This is a thread about things going on this site, no need to bring "the other" into it, especially if your facts are incorrect
The more i look Hoolio, the more i discover how myself and the other Two Amigo's have had many membership privileges removed and we are no longer allowed to post in ANY of the car forums..... :jerkoff:Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoolio
This is true. But alas not from PM fromMiller. Ashy has been informative , as have Lee , Slammed66 , Chris and a few others. I have asked stuff from IanS and he has been forthcoming too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Steve - Raider
And I cant help but noting its the CM and Mods who jump in a shown the yawn faces with a vast majority being in support on the non CM ..
Just an observation like ..
Can a CM help me out here ? Publicly ?
Over on 21toc , if I create a vote as an admin I can see who voted which way. I cant change it but I can view it.
Can you guys do that ?
Reason being , I really need to see if it is the Dave + Andy show in all this.
If I created a vote asking a generic question of :
Do you think the club is being run in the correct way
with 3 answers.
Yes
No
Dont care
I wouldnt want the members to think they are being spied upon.
Does that seem fair ?
Thing is Andy, how does that help. We already know there is a problem, what we need to know is where the biggest problem lies & try to address it in a manner that suits everyone equally.
He's got a point, the description is badly worded considering whats going on round the club, baiting almost.Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
Steve. Did you type the first part with your face then mate? :pQuote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
Ok , my plan was as follows. Condensed stuff as not to bore the pants off you just yet.
1st Vote : Issues
Yes/No/Maybe
2nd Vote :
What with?
Multiple vote areas such as
Website / Mobile Access / CM / Democracy of voting in to CM / Classified / Facebook Integration.
Then based on that what you can do is work out what the major issues are , fend them off and fix them , and start working through the issues. Otherwise you are just scatter gun approaching.
That make sense ?
Careful Ash , you will be branded into the Dave and Andy club.Quote:
Originally Posted by Red October
On a serious point at least its not just me ..
( or Dave )
Yep, perfect sense..... be nice if it was as clear cut as that, don't think it will be though.. someone, somewhere is still going to be put out... what will you do if it's you ?Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
Democracy and majority rules doesn't it ?Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
Its the way it should be.
Do it that way over on 21TOC and most other boards. Inevitably someone will feel put out , but if its 1 in 100 then unfortunately that's life. You can please everyone all the time.
We were, and still are apart from me and Ian S, he won't be my friend because he thinks i'm DaveL, whereas I am actually DaveL485, an entirely different person.Quote:
Originally Posted by Va Va Voom
This is where my particular issues began, and the way I have been reacted to because of this, the repeated attacks and vilification is why I take particular pleasure in pointing out the shortfallings of the way this place is run. And there are many.
It's crazy really, a recognition of error and an apology would have turned me from a bullied and bitter member into a useful resource, but instead i'm now branded as a trouble making conspirator with ambition to take over the whole club. According to the powers that be, I am in cohorts with Andy Bond to achieve global domination, starting with the RTOC.
It's also massively entertaining, watching this lot screw over a car club. Massively. I am truly entranced and intrigued trying to figure out how the collective intelligence of the hierarchy reach their decisions.
I think I might give Jeremy Kyle a ring. It'll be a nice change from DNA tests, Adultery and bottom feeding mouth breathers abusing each other between dole cheques :laugh:
If this is your sole motivation then you just lost a degree of support.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
Hoolio,Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoolio
Dont take that post literally dude.
I think some of it is tongue in cheeky. Especially the world domination thing.
I am going alone for that bit.
If you review my posts, suggestions and so on, I think you'll find there is good material there. I am losing interest in this club though after the treatment of me and my friends recently....so yes sadly for RTOC I shall be diverting my efforts elsewhere, by the looks of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoolio
Good post though. Kind of shot me down there. You should be on the committee, thats the way it should be done :agree:
But but but....you promised..... :cry::cry:Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
Tbh I did take it with a small pinch of salt and I agree things could have been handled a lot better (on all sides) I would really prefer it if nobody left ( I got banned from the RTOF for trying to start that discussion) and you know we really need people with drive and energy to keep this place moving.
:agree:Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoolio
Good show. Keep that attitude up and you'll get a ban :laugh:
[adds pinch of salt]
Baiting actually :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Red October
I'll change it to something more serious at some point, perhaps when I feel a predominantly amicable vibe :)
Remember this is a discussion about this site not others. Anyone can come see your posts and it did come across especially when u admitted coming across just to say what you did, as trying to start grief between 2 forums
I could say thats an abuse of power.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian S
But I wont.
( was that amicable enough ? :D )
:agree:Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoolio
A FAR better question is, "please suggest how you think the club could be managed better".Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
We don't need votes and polls. Look at that poll Gordon did. 30 responses. That's normal around these parts to that sort of thing.
Tbh I did take it with a small pinch of salt and I agree things could have been handled a lot better (on all sides) I would really prefer it if nobody left ( I got banned from the RTOF for trying to start that discussion) and you know we really need people with drive and energy to keep this place moving.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoolio
tell you what here it is
"Brilliant, asking want we want and all the answers so far have been pretty much what is already available elsewhere. Instead of jumping ship why are you guys not staying put and trying to fix it. Ridiculous."
not really a start to a discussion i don't think more a statement.
Too open a question Ian. Too many variables.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian S
Starting with digital answers where there are only two variables and drill down later.
I already stated very clearly that I NEVER thought you are DaveL, and that as far as I know THIS IS NO DAVEL. And that I merely couldn't be bothered to reach over and press 485.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
No you're committee bashing started that whole thing off, causing the reaction from the committee. Would scarcely have know you existed otherwise. You made a big splash and a bad name for yourself.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
You've worked hard to achieve this status.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
I have given you this many times. You just respond with abuse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian S
Elect a new Chairman, someone with the time and motivation to manage the club, be proactive, reactive, innovative and responsive.
He should redefine roles and redistribute workload according to availability and capability of resource, consulting with those resources in doing so. Roles with more than one volunteer can be elected by club vote if so desired.
The Chairman manages these roles and supports where necessary. Obviously there is a little more to it than that, but thats the core of it. Thats the first step.
My initial response to this was one word. "Resign". In an attempt not to be a complete ****head, I decided to make one last attempt at reason. Do with it what you will. It will benefit everyone, but if I had to select one person it would benefit most, Ian, it would be you.
You don't help yourself :sad2:Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian S
A growing number of people will be glad to read that.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
In fact we're starting to learn that you're the reason some members are leaving. Not to go to the other site, just to get away from you posts. And Andy's, the two of you bouncing off each other, hence the new phrase, the Andy and Dave show, that's not a compliment.
You are a LIAR. A plain, downright liar. You have outright accused me of being this other bloke twice on an open forum.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian S
You even made point of saying I was banned for this-and-that and I went and asked Bruce Hockley to confirm I was not this guy, which he did.
I can't believe you even dare type that Ian, it's such a blatant lie.
You have some gall. You really do. I wonder if you would be this brave in person. Unlikely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian S
As we've been saying and asking for continuously for years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoolio
& so we start again.. :cry:
A yes / no is meaningless.Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
Maybe as well start the 'drilling down' at the start.
Especially as we already know the final answer. The club has needed more help for a long time and has not been in receipt of it. The club does not need to get rid of anyone. It needs more people doing actual work.
People leave fast enough of their own accord as it is.
And enough to get me a ban? I've said worse on Clio sport and been fine and they really are a bunch of fascists.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adey aka Ewok
Andy, can you think of anything you can offer the club as help ? Serious question, you are quite vocal, so lets try to put it to some good use maybe ?
If you see Moggy's thread it does pretty much sum things up, what has happened before & is happening now & some suggestions on how we should start moving forward, not backwards as we seem to be now.
content removed by me (5teve) as it does nothing other than cause more problems & had other members names involved...
thats a matter for a different site, though im happy to discuss it further but not here, when i was under fire here and that's getting posted up there, along with screenshots being used against me, my first response close the doors down for a while until everything calmed down. apologies if this was not your intention but thats how it came across, especially when it wasnt really a new thread or a discussion more a dig. no more needs to be said regarding it on this site as discussing issues between the sites really isnt good practiceQuote:
Originally Posted by Hoolio
Andy can't answer as to what the club needs as he doesn't have a clue, his goal is to have Daves helmet so deep up his arse King Arthur himself couldn't free it.
Why are these pr1cks even being humoured. All they are doing is stirring sh1t. We all know it.
Give them a refund and ask them to close the door on the way out. :agree:
The plan was to do away with the title of chairman or president as some people see it as their target. I feel we'd be better with a group of people sharing the work load.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
There is a role for someone to join the dots at times and that has been missing. But no-one has offered up their services.
Generally people who have had some solid help to offer have been gratefully welcomed by the rest of the management team and started getting on with it.
Often a few weeks later they realised they had either not the time or not the motivation and left again.
In a club this small with so little help that is meaningless. There are no roles with more than one volunteer!!! You can read but you appear to not comprehend. It seems like you memorised or cut and paste these definitions from a management text book.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
You have made some mature posts lately. If you started and carried on that way things would have gone a lot better. The calendar thing was great. You do seem like you have some energy and might be able to be useful. I'm not sure anyone will want to work with you.
And to a lot on onlookers it really does appear that you just want what you perceive to be the top job for yourself.
I was repeating to you what other people are saying. Not my feeling.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
Your post looks like you are threatening me with violence.
Really, for a while I've been standing in the way of you being outright banned.
I'm no longer going to do that.
There are member complaints about you. Committee complaints about you. People leaving because of you. People asking why are we letting you carrying on like you are.
I have stated that. I did not mean I think you are someone called DaveL.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
Dave... Ian... SHUT UP! NOW
this is going in bloody circles and is NOT HELPING, i know who both of you are and thats all that matters, and I love you both equally
right back to my sheep
Giving the '3 Amigos' full access back would be a start.Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
I guess we'll never get 'that' decision explanation, so fine, let's let bygones be bygones, and get back on with the show.
Or is there still some axe to grind with us?
I personally don't know Mart. That would be for those who know the full details.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mart
Personally, like I said, from my point of view it looked a little knee-jerk with all that was going on, but then I may not know the full story ??? If there was more to it of course.
Mainly because I didn't think of it :)Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
Scoff did look into that option of people selecting what they wanted in the live window but he hasn't time to pull that one off. Anyway, it maybe all change in a few weeks.
yeah.... your a shandy drinker in a foreign land :wasntme:Quote:
Originally Posted by Mart
:laugh:Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggy
Btw, you moany Welsh barsteward ;) I personally didn't see your post asking about the Sangliers hotel. If you didn't get a reply, which I guess you didn't, you should've dropped me an abusive text :D
I disagree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian S
If you start with a yes / no you have already asked a killer question.
Those with the No can drop out. For you can deal with them later.
Those on the yes side can now be queried.
Funny how the thread was OK before he showed up ain't it. You'll notice he particularly singled me out again as well, despite that car crash idiot being even more obnoxious than I....not to mention his fellow CM sweeping the evidence of his outright lies under the rug by editing my post.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggy
I'm done with the arguments now anyway. I'll leave the self-pitying, bitter, defunct old man to his miserable life.
I have offered web services , offered to point people in the direction of RTOC.Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
I would be happy to liase with other groups.
On the sole proviso I was voted to do the job by the members
Quote:
Originally Posted by dangerous dave
Quote:
Originally Posted by car.crash
Here comes captain and chaos.
Hold hands lads . Play nice.
Mr Car Crash , I trust one way we will meet. I hope so.
I've put a button at the top of the Live window to toggle between filtered and un-filtered :)Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
You will have to re-load the Live window to see it.
Its wrong what they say about you Scoff.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoff
I told them all the time.
;)
No politics here. I'm just doing what I think helps everyone. :)
With genuine feeling , I think I am too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoff
Did we get an answer on this? Given that this section of the boards is now called "Beyond this gate there will be monsters, enter at your peril." I guess we wont and the axe's are sharpening up nicely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mart
Can i request a refund of 3/4 of my membership fee given that i'm not getting my moneys worth now.
There is a big division in this club at the moment. I am a member here and on the "forum that shan't be named". I am sick to death of all this bollocks every time I log in on here.
There are members on here which I don't particularly like, and vice versa but we make sure we steer clear and have minimal doings with each other.
This is going to sound a bit stupid, but if you don't like someone, just ignore them.
And if you really can't stand someone, PM them & arrange a place you can meet up and discuss face to face. If their opinion is different to yours, put your side over in a diplomatic way, thus engaging debate.
Wolves don't care about the opinions of sheep. Words to live by.
Enough of all this bullshit.
Rtoc are looking at this wrong.
Members took it upon them selfs to build a better forum.
Rather than get all bitchy about it, what Rtoc should do is sit down and think why did they feel the need to make a better forum, what is Rtoc doing wrong to make members feel like that, what can Rtoc do different.
The way Rtoc is handling this, too me is very sad, Rtoc is a well known forum for many many years, so why be scared of a newly made forum with hardly any posts on it?
Maybe a bit of competition would be good for Rtoc to kick it up the arse and bring life back into it.
All this bollocks has nothing to do with the club its about the people in it.Anyone no longer interested in these cars needs to do one.These cars attract young,old,northerners and southerners.Basically people that are totally different from one another and under normal circumstances would never mix.Thats why the club and the people in it need to keep it about the cars and nothing else.If someone posts something and you can help,then reply even if you dont like that person.:hump:
Exactly. :agree:Quote:
Originally Posted by casper
I would, but the '3 amigos' have been locked out of posting in the 'main forums' as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by casper
What with the lack of replies to our questions, I'm not sure what's trying to be achieved here?
I will answer this the open forum Dave as I have nothing to hide, please don't PM anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
I had to delete the whole thing as it not only had your point in it, being a screen grab (where did you get that BTW) it also had other members names in it, which quite frankly puts us 3 steps back rather than just fuelling the Dave vs Ian fires that you were trying to do.
I hope that answers your question. No sweeping up, hiding evidence etc. I was just doing what I thought best for the forum.
You have some followers, some haters, some that don't really care & are just fed up with all the sh1t stirring that you seem to do. As soon as Ian posted you jumped on him, he defends himself & it continues.... I'm fed up with it & I'm sure most of RTOC is, just leave it both of you.
Personally I have got to the stage where if it were up to me, I'd just ban you, not because you have an opinion, but because you are plain annoying now.
Wow, you're as deluded as he is then...hairy muff. Duly noted.Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
Its not really full on bona fida genuine out of the ordinary reason for a ban thst Steve. Ban ricardo cos he has gone supercharged. Thats annoyed me. ( nowt personal ricardo ) . C'mon, thats just not a valid genuine reason.Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
Andy, wind it in.Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
So, let me get this straight, I protest at being flamed by Ian due to a case of mistaken identity, he continues to rip me up and dirty my name on here, I protest, he continues, I protest more, he then denies he ever mistook me for someone else, I post evidence that that is an outright lie, then YOU cover it up AND then try and make us be quiet?Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
Jesus Christ. Morality or integrity are obviously not required to serve on the Committee :disagree: After the treatment of Mart, Steve and Ady as well you should be utterly ashamed, all of you.
At least they can still access the site Dave!Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
You're a moderator on that board, so what does that say for your morality and integrity? Have you complained about unfair treatment on there?
Pot & kettle
You had your access back days ago, if you tried logging on before running your mouth you would know thatQuote:
Originally Posted by Slammed 66
Seeing as we had no place to discuss that, it's a little hard to know wouldn't you say?Quote:
Originally Posted by Adey aka Ewok
And as it turns out you're wrong. Perhaps if you'd have checked before running your mouth you'd have noticed still banned
In fairness I have no place to discuss my issue, I get no response.Quote:
Originally Posted by Slammed 66
For the other comment then I do apologise, I lifted the ban late on the 10th or so I thought. I will look into it when I can get to a PC. Again apologies if I am in the wrong.
Accepted and thankyou :agree:Quote:
Originally Posted by Adey aka Ewok
You are both as bad as each other now.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL485
I already stated that I felt there was probably a knee-jerk reaction over Steve, Mart & Adey, I can't see the CM boards so can't say anything more on that.
I covered nothing up, if it just involved you & Ian I would have left the post, I couldn't edit it as it was a screen shot & had other members names in it that I thought would just drag more crap up again, as I stated previous, so no hiding anything. I have deleted nothing else of yours.
My personal feelings toward you are that I feel you should be banned, if Andy carries on, the same for him, maybe not permanent but a ban all the same till the site starts to move forward, which it can't with you two piping up all the time.
I think we need to move forward with some of the suggestions from members in Moggys thread, you just keep taking us back & will always do that all the time Ian is here, newsflash, I doubt Ian will be going anywhere, he has done & still does more than you know to keep RTOC running, I very much doubt anyone else, save Scoff, would put in as much free time just to keep a car club running over the last 10 or more years, especially with the amount of crap they get for doing it.
Only a couple of sections, but, granted, it's not an out-right ban.Quote:
Originally Posted by Slammed 66
As I posted before though, I'm failing to see why this was implemented in the first place, and what it's now trying to achieve?
[/scratched record]
Steve , I haven't give Ian crap. I have tried to help with some bits and feedback on others.Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
I think its a fair thing if I said that Ian and myself aren't going to see eye to eye on things and leave it at that. I think that's fair Ian ?
Ill sit back , and be ready and waiting to help if needed. If not I know of a few plans that are going to happen and I am excited to see how they pan out.
Why has Dave been Banned then Committee??
http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/n...eT/Capture.jpg
Who of the 3 Amigo's will be next..
I'm sure we can guess, you aren't a daft lad Steve.
I'm also sure the committee will post up, not that they have to give a reason at all to us.
You, me, the committee and 95% of the members.Quote:
Originally Posted by TopCat
I'm sick of it tooQuote:
Originally Posted by Guybrush
Oh my, quelle surprise! Someone noticed that thread exists then. For so many to professQuote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
their tiredness of all the negativity, it seems that people still prefer to head for this thread
instead.
I had put some thought into what I posted there. My hope being that peeps might pick
it up and run with it - bouncing some positive ideas about which perhaps we can live with.
No such luck...
I'll leave you guys to your "Acrimonious whinging" - it's so clearly in vogue here :( :cry:
Regards,
Steve
The answer to all this is very easy.
Everyone step down. Then the club, all members whom wish to vote, can vote the admin/commitee in.
If at that point, all the same admin get in. Thats it. Discussion over.
This club was ran far far better in the last decade.
Time for change.
Agreed:agree:
Time For Change!
There needs to be action now, no more words! stick a poll up to see if the members want change or not.
Agreed, we do.... but we need 'doers' not people that say they will do things & then back out after a few weeks of it.. There aren't many that are willing to give up personal time to keep a car club running..
So the committee steps down how does the club keep goin while the vote goes on ? And then say new members get voted in how do they know what to do or how to do it?:confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenobi
You don't know until you try!:)Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
I don't think you can just oust the current committee, I think if people want roles they should be bought into the CM to 'help', see how they get on & then a vote. Or we could end up as Chris says, with a load of new people without a clue what to do.... it won't work.Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil W
Some roles are easy to do, some are not.
Being a member of a shooting club that has a committee & constitution (of which I am on the committee), trust me it won't work.
Could you dissolve the current people , vote in a "holding" member and form the comittee whilst being overseen by the holding member.Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
Once the commitee is formed the holding member retires ?
Phil you say time for change can you tell me what you want to change and how you would do it ?:)
I feel what we need to do is people continue adding to Moggys thread https://www.rtoc.org/boards/showthread.php?t=36004.
This way we should start to see a pattern of what people think needs to happen, & maybe some suggestions will come from it that make sense (as they already have) & we can implement them into the club.
Not everyone will be happy, no-one ever is, that's life unfortunately.
I for one would like to do a simple vote, who is happy with the way the club is run, who wants change, who doesn't care as long as the crap stops.
Hey up buddy. I have proposed this but had the answer that people on here dont vote.Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
I would counter that if you force people to vote they will ...
Add this into Moggys thread please if you have some input though Phil, or it will get lost in this thread. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by chris
It is true, in the past the voting thing hasn't worked, I feel, like you, we should give this a go to see the outcome. It would need to be worded simply & have 3 options ??Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
I think you have to phrase the questions positivity.Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
1) Do you feel change is needed within the running of the club
A) Yes
B) No
etc
I dont think this will come to fruition though unfortunately.
Good idea keeping everything in one thread so that people's views and opinions do not get lost.
However, might I add that if a member does ask a question or come up with an idea, that those who are in the position of oversight of the club and the decision makers answer that question? Even if they think the idea is foolish or completely unrealistic, just a response saying so would show members that their opinions are at least being heard.
Thank you
Thats a top idea.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammer
Any vote on electoral matters should require a minimum % of the membership to take part in order for the results to stand.
It would maybe make sense not to use the total number of club members as the 100% measure, since a number are totally/virtually inactive. Perhaps those who have logged on to the site at least x times in the last x months should be used to identify the total number of active members.
For example:
total members - 400
total members deemed 'active' - 180
% required for electoral voting to be legitimate - 51%
Minimum votes required - 92
A mailshot to the membership could be done beforehand.
Hold the vote before people step down then.
So the current Gang/Posse stay in place and simply apply for thier roles.
Im sure some of the staff will stay in place even after voting.
You can see who is likely to get voted out as they are the ones least likely to accept this kind of reform.
:agree:
Seems logical. :agree:Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevhib
There is no need for reforms to achieve the above. Those things are already covered within the existing club rules.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenobi
This is just a con.Quote:
Originally Posted by andybond
With all due respect, I have no respect for this nonsense.
The answer will be an overwhelming yes!
Even if a tiny tiny change is needed, then there is only one answer.
There is always some change needed.
So lets our save ourselves a load a time wasting and lets assume the vote has happened and the answer was yes.
• What changes are proposed.
• This is what the club as a whole needs to identify and work on.
The committee are very busy lately making a lot of changes.
Danny, i have a lot of time for you mate.. but you don't half talk some :crap: sometimes.. :wasntme:Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenobi
Ian , If I had of posted that you would have come down on me like a ton of bricks. Anyway , work through the next bit with me :Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian S
Assume what Trev said was taken up , 51% of all active people need to vote.
If 51% of the active vote , voted that NO they dont think anything needs doing then continue down the path that you are going down.
If it goes the other way , then readdress.
Its not a snipe or a winge at you or the CM , its to find out if there is a problem. I dont get why you are so defensive over this bit ? I appreciate everything in life can be improved on , but there is little point in terms of a club if noone wants it. That is all the first question is establishing.
I know the CM are working on stuff because we have had long PM's about it but the other guys out there will have to read between the lines and the post the Ross has put up. Why not tell them the things that you guys are trying to achieve ? Everyone loves a trier , even if some of the stuff doesnt come off.
When you put it like that, fair enough :)
There has been so much antagonism and sniping lately with little or no real justification.
We know that some changes are needed, already established that ages ago.
The simple problem is, and has been, lack of man power.
It's good and encouraging that people do make a general offer to help out. The difficult part is matching that to what needs to be done.
One role here probably is someone to do that matching.
Establish what is needed, write some detail and establish what it is that people offering can do.
If I or other people currently managing the cub could easily whip this up then we would have by now.
I was up until nearly 3 am again last night doing general stuff for the RTOC. On Saturday I worked 13 for the RTOC of the 14 hours I was up. Yesterday, today, a lot of days, a lot of hours. Other people have been putting in a lot of time lately too.
It would be good people offered to do some specific task that we could get going. Two people offered to do stuff with the home page a few months ago but that was not so easy to make happen. In time it may be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5teve L
LOL hi lover.
:cooter:
I think we nearly agreed on something.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian S
This could be uncharted territory.
:eek:
I dont think anyone out there doubts your work and commitment to the club Ian. I never have.
Ok instead of voting on the current committee positions, like some people want, would it not be better to list all the roles that need filling with a brief description of the roll and candidates can put there names down and we can vote all these new people in that can help out. Makes sense to fill these rolls first before we have any major change. Just an idea
I see what you are saying , but some people might not like or want to work alongside the current people plus in whatever short timefram they might have to revote.
I think the idea of a steering group could work , or alternatively a transitional Chairman who does holds the club together for the few weeks that a transition is in place.
Failing that , Scoff is politically uncorrputable so could keep the site running in transient times.
But this is moot until it is ascertained whether a change is wanted.
Hey if it's not the old leader of the call of duty 3 [c][t] clan!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenobi
You still playing? I am although not half as sharp as I used to be :(
Little punks!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevhib
:agree: have to agree a vote is the only way around this. Maybe also give the positions / roles a length of time a couple of years:scratch:.
Agree with that .Quote:
Originally Posted by James5
They already do.
https://www.rtoc.org/club/?show=committee
the rules currently state, if i read them wrong that the term is a year, and members stand for re election, voted for by the committee and then told to the club at the agm. thats if im reading them right? thing is i think we are all thinking along the lines of the club voting but as far as i read ( again could be wrong) the committee make the decisions on who are in the committee? Is this correct?
arghhhhh dam no edit button! unless i read them wrong not if i read them wrong, also could of deleted it after the link was posted :crap:Quote:
Originally Posted by Adey aka Ewok
From my experiance it's more like ...we have a vacancy ...no-one applies for the role or at most only a couple and if we are lucky we manage to get someone that sticks with it for more than a few months ...
Yes the committe make the decision but that's irrelevant if it's a choice of 1 .
Sorry to piss on any parades of a brave new world but really ,honestly, and with zero axe to grind that's what happens Adey .
yeah cool, just double checking that's how it was written. I think the general majority of people are thinking that they some how get to vote members into the committee, and thats just not how it works :agree:
OK, so now that this thread has turned toward positive replies, here's my 2p.
Having closely read the club constitution, there is IMO a flaw - one which inevitably leads
to accusations of clique etc. There should be clear demarcations between elected officers
and appointees. The top 4 positions, plus committee members per se should all be elected
by the membership - preferably by postal ballot / online ballot. Terms of office should also
be looked at - maybe eligible for up to 4 years, in place for 2 years without challenge.
The appointed officers should only be appointed by the committee - events organiser,
shopkeeper, publicity officer, etc. They should not be considered as committee members!
All appointed officers can/should attend committee meetings but whether or not they
take part in a committee vote should be in the gift of the chairman.
The whole point is to spread the workload over as many heads as possible so that the
post-holders are able to give it their all. Many hands etc...
The above should go some way toward solving current issues.
Regards,
Steve
People keep moaning and making opinions on about the club ,why don't we just have a vote about the changes etc or this threads will go on and on ,or is the commitee keep going to ban members and restrict them
Greetings!Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottKinnear
add me fella HtecElite-Kenobi
Will do.. You playing on ps4?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenobi
Come again :scratch:Quote:
Originally Posted by gtmatt
Edited it , done on my phone as the website is phone friendly :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashy
The committee has never been the 'clique'. Some members have commented over the years that there have been a group of members who think they ARE the RTOC rather than part of it. This has gone on a lot longer than there's been committee.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lowiepete
The whole point of the committee is to spread the workload so it's not just one person and maybe a couple of friends doing everything.
Thats the best way to achieve the common goal. Fill the roles that are empty and provide any support for the people in roles who are struggling or busy. Sort of like a gym buddy per se. We all know life is busy and sometimes it takes priority over hobbies and intrests so a role helper would make sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lowiepete
There is so much energy and abundance in this club im sure it wont crack, fade or splinter. Its how we all channel our efforts. In moggys thread there is the answer to 99% of problems or most issues the club has.
From someone who over the last few weeks who has become sick to death of the acrimonious whinging, perhaps there is some light in the tunnel. Good luck to all who are positively involved and the comittee :agree:
The fact some of them are busy on here at 1.38am as I post is a testament to there commitment.
Please Ian, don't take my posts out of context. Now is not the time for CMs to be on theQuote:
Originally Posted by Ian S
defensive. The emphasis is that there have been such accusations quite vociferously
made and under your present constitution that perception will continue, regardless of it
being real or not. I'm not making accusations here! I'm simply commenting upon a quite
dreadful situation as I see it. Someone with fresh eyes and dismayed by the negativity.
As for your last sentence, again, isn't that exactly what people have perceived to have
happened? All I've read of late is that too few people are sufficiently active. I agree with
the spirit of what you're saying, wholeheartedly, and the suggestions I'm making are not
attacks, but simply a different, more open, way of looking at things. We all hate change,
but change is inevitable if the club is to move ahead. No organisation stands still and
thrives.
Regards,
Steve