Fiberglass 5GTT grills for the shop

A member, Robbie, from Ireland, has a pal who can make fibreglass products. Discussions have been taking place via PM's for a few weeks with them, me, Dale, regarding making up some OE looking GTT grills. However, they are not able to fabricate the rear clips that interlock with the 'slam panel' and locate the grill in it's correct position. They propose to use some form of threaded bush within a stalk and let the owners bolt the grills on.

He is now looking for an OE grill to see about taking a mould from.

Here's where we're up to:

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Originally Posted by robx1r

fibreglass would be too brittle to make the OE clips from and the way a fibreglass product is made it would be near impossible to do it. we were going to make a support and use what's call a rivnut so you can bolt it

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Would it possible to make up an example of this nut and bolt fixing as it would join to the 5GTT so testers could offer it up to their 5GTT and see what they all think and then see if buyers would be happy with that?

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Originally Posted by bigfoot

Due to the location of the fixing points for the grill I believe that any kind of bolt / rivnut will not be feasible as its difficult enough to unclip the original style as it is let alone trying to get a socket / spanner behind there to remove the grill. Could there be a way of bonding a plastic release clip as I feel that you need a way of removing the grills by hand, or could use some sort of wing nut style might be ok, but may be too difficult to remove due to lack of space in front of the alternator.
Dale

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My concern with a bolt would be the lack of centring that the OE clip provides as a bolt might be a lot smaller than the hole.

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Originally Posted by Bigfoot

The clips on the back are more of holding it going forward rather than centralising it. As you still have the 3 clips at the top of the grill plus the front indicators holding it from each side. I have fitted quite a few grills without the need of the clips at the back due to being broken without it being a major problem.

Maybe even having a fibreglass bit which locates in the hole and then a split pin or some sort of thing to hold it in place maybe a better idea.

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Originally Posted by chris

The rivnuts work perfect with a captive thread. I had a grill with rivnuts bonded in far stronger than original and access is not a problem them bottom clips always brake most people just bond a piece of threaded bar in place. I have a grill with this setup as a spare

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This gives you an idea these are roughly done with just thread fiberglassed in i bought the grill because i was going to leave it open for an oil cooler but change of plan. but anyway this just gives you an rough idea
http://i1225.photobucket.com/albums/...6/SAM_0514.jpg

Just out of interest, was it easy access because of it being an open grill to get in front of the alternator?

Ah now that is a good question I will go have a look again and let you know

It is tight but not impossible the lads are going to have to produce a prototype but I think it sounds promising :)

That's what I was thinking, might not help having large hands working on these cars sometimes. Main issue really is getting a good grill over to Rob so they can use to replicate it

Yea thats true my one has the lugs broken but otherwise is perfect and unpainted

He needs such a grill to get the mould from.

But would it be better to have one with the lugs not broken?

I guess the club might have to buy someone's grill for this project in case it's damaged in the transport, handling / mould taking process.

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Originally Posted by Bigfoot

More than likely in the region of £300 which is not worthwhile in doing so. Safest bet would be if there is one over in Ireland already to replicate. I do have a grill which is one another car which is off the road, has the tabs at top broken but the clips on the back are all good, only problem being I don't know when I can go over to the car to get it as it is at another members house.

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Originally Posted by Slammed 66

Or maybe borrow one for a nominal fee? Say £30 to borrow it on the condition that it's returned it the same condition?

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Can you all between you get this fixings thing agreed on and get a grill to copy. :)

I have an o.e grill sat here that could be used, however the two end fixings on the top are broken and the slats are also broken where they join towards the bottom of the grill.

It would be easy to mark out the top two missing fixings and araldite the slats for the molding process, I wouldn't mind if it was broken as long as I get one of the replica grills afterwards or this grill returned.

What ever grille is given will have any defects repaired to a perfect finish, and it doesnt matter about the clips as we cant make them, he has a campus grill and i've been wrecking his head over it if i could get a picture of how the lower tabs sit on the inside of the car we can work around it

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Originally Posted by Ian S

He needs such a grill to get the mould from.

But would it be better to have one with the lugs not broken?

I guess the club might have to buy someone's grill for this project in case it's damaged in the transport, handling / mould taking process.

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The making of the mould will almost certainly destroy the original :crap:

nope not in the slightest, i've moulded some small complex things before and it was all good, only problem could be pulling paint off,

GT Phil says he will take a development replica item in return if the original is bust up in the process. So there's no issue there.

If that replica has a small £-value that needs covering, the club should be able to cover that cost IMO. Good opportunity this, if the grilles can be made to a reasonable standard. :agree:

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Originally Posted by robx1r

nope not in the slightest, i've moulded some small complex things before and it was all good, only problem could be pulling paint off,

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I've attempted to mould a gtt grill before and it broke every slat between each bar when it came to removing the grill from the mould and that was a fully waxed grill and release agent.
Not saying it cant be done but its certainly not easy and i wouldnt want to lend a mint grill out for £30 under the pretence it can be returned in the same condition.
Im sure you guys can sort it tho and the end result will be brilliant for the club :agree:

here is some of his work, either way, the grille i get will be given back fit for service, if its damaged it would be repaired, or the club could supply a replica?

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r...ps8446f61f.jpg

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r...pse1e1085a.jpg

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r...ps5db2773a.jpg

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r...ps5db2773a.jpg

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r...ps5d110f64.jpg

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r...psbeb03804.jpg

Gents, since GTPhil's grille is neither mint nor required to be returned in the same condition as long as a replica is supplied, there is nothing to be concerned about is there?? Are you not seeing the posts?

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Originally Posted by Trevhib

Gents, since GTPhil's grille is neither mint nor required to be returned in the same condition as long as a replica is supplied, there is nothing to be concerned about is there?? Are you not seeing the posts?

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Yes Trev, its just conversation :)
I have no doubt in the skills of Robbies contacts.

that would be perfect as he'd spend a while getting it perfect before moulding.

what do you say gtphill???

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Originally Posted by Jonny5

Yes Trev, its just conversation :)
I have no doubt in the skills of Robbies contacts.

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exactly this is something that is wanted and is going to get even rarer so any questions i can put back to them?

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Originally Posted by GTphil

I have an o.e grill sat here that could be used, however the two end fixings on the top are broken and the slats are also broken where they join towards the bottom of the grill.

It would be easy to mark out the top two missing fixings and araldite the slats for the moulding process

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We have an offer of an unpainted one with no damage to any of the parts that are going to be copied, ie, only the rear lower clips are damaged.

That's seems like a better idea to take copies from a perfect one and not a repaired one.

So can an agreement be arrived at over the method of fixing please.

Robbie that Citroen grill looks rather thin and weak in that photo. How does that compare with the original? Especially as the OE Renault one seems to crack quite often at the slats inner fixing point.

that was sitting under a load of spoilers and wings and the like it was a first copy

Good effort guys, i can't see myself ever parting with £150 for a second hand grill, that's 10% of what I paid for the full car.. It's things like this that keep me from selling up.. :agree:

Couple more key words;

Locking nuts that don't fall off if they back off.

Square blocks that go through the holes each side of the radiator to help locate the grill.

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Originally Posted by robx1r

yeah that's what the support tabs were going to do, bring it right up to the car and locate in the holes then with the riv nut we were going to use a bolt and washer to attach it to make it look nice and professional. I wish I could draw so I could show you! or we could do the opposite and mount bolts into the grille so you can put a lock nut on it?

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Originally Posted by robx1r

He can even add dye's into the resin and fibre glas so say if its on a black car and painted, if you get a stone chip you wont see nasty white fibreglass behind it as it will be dyed black completely through, he can do 60 different colours

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It's up to members to agree on these details in this thread. I'm passing that over to you all :)

I won't want to pay for stuff that members decide they don't want to buy and sits in Dales storage for 10 years.

In previous group buys there would be sample made and checked on behalf of the group by someone sufficiently discerning, then people pay up front and they are then made. That might be a better way might be for this to proceed?

I'm at a disadvantage with organising schemes like this as I don't have a working 5GTT and seem to care less and less about that as time goes by. I may just have to scrap them and move on at some point as I'm not getting any younger or more able to afford to maintain and run a car.

my car is off getting a cage made, so i'm so i'm going off a campus grille,
he'd want to e paid for the mould and sample i assume, but i'll say it to him, as for the lower mounting its which ever is deemed the easiest to live with,

Hey,

I would love to buy one of those :agree::agree::agree:

Have anyone try to contact renault if they are intrested in produceing new grills? :scratch:

any word from the comittee?

There is a commitee???:laugh::laugh:

The moulds failed so they cant be done from this person, we are trying other solutions on getting these made up.

If Handy Andy ever gets back on here, he's got a very good contact who he has been doing bussinness with this end for some time may be able to help.