View Full Version : Legal advice
Its a complicated carry on but the basic crooks of the problem is:
My next door neighbour owns the piece of land next to my garage, its a strange setup, but he has decided to build a garage on his land (which is fair enough). However, the issue is he wants to build it onto the side of my garage. i.e. stitch it into my current brickwork and extend my roof over his garage!
Anyway he has let me know his intentions and I arranged a meeting with his builders so they could explain exactly what they wanted to do. I reviewed the info with the wife and we had a number of concerns. We had a second meeting with our neighbour and let him know of our concerns saying that we weren't saying that he couldn't do it but we needed him to resolve our concerns first.
This morning we get a letter from the local planning office notifying us that he had submitted the plans for his planning application and the cheeky fecker had submitted plans based on building onto our garage!
I've spoken to the planning office today and they say that the fact that we don't want him to build onto our property isn't within their remit, they only look at things like blocking light & aesthetics etc. They will still grant permission even if we lodge a dispute. They have advised that we need to contact a solicitor or citizens advice etc...
I have read and understood the party wall act etc but I don't think this applies as our wall is straddling a boundary etc its our wall on our land.
Just wondered if anyone else had been in a similar position? or maybe knows what type of solicitor I should contact? are there ones that specialise in building disputes etc? I don’t want to spend a load of cash on a legal dispute.
Surely he can't touch our property without our consent, even if he does get planning permission.
you say you received a letter from the local planning office ,did you speak to your
neighbour after that ?? i see you may want to follow the "my rights vs his rights"
route but at the end of the day having a civilaised man to man talk can solve things
faster and would not leave a sour taste with your neighbour .
thats my 2 pence mullas anyway :agree:
aye I'm going to speak to him about it, its all been done face to face upto this point. Thing is our house has just gone up for sale so I'm not planning on being here for long, so I dont want a building site next to the house when people come to view!!
aye I'm going to speak to him about it, its all been done face to face upto this point. Thing is our house has just gone up for sale so I'm not planning on being here for long, so I dont want a building site next to the house when people come to view!!
rent your current house to some students m8 who dont give a toss....make it bloody expesive so it pays that mortgage and half of your new house.....then when evie is 18 move her in there.problem solved....what a winner.....next.........:laugh:
Can't you just kick him in the head? I'll push him down a hill if you like?...for a price :)
Matt Cole
27-08-2009, 23:05
Is he being arsey about it mate?? There is no way he should touch your property if you have objections. Plus, having planning permission means nowt if objections are lodged etc and all disputes must be took into consideration.
knock your garage down, see what he does then.
knock your garage down, see what he does then.
:wasntme:
rent your current house to some students m8 who dont give a toss....make it bloody expesive so it pays that mortgage and half of your new house.....then when evie is 18 move her in there.problem solved....what a winner.....next.........:laugh:
Idealy i'd love too mate but its all about the equity... We looked into buy to let mortgages on this house but we need the equity as a deposit on the next house. Lenders wont give you a decent rate on your mortgage unless you have a 25% deposit!!!
Is he being arsey about it mate?? There is no way he should touch your property if you have objections. Plus, having planning permission means nowt if objections are lodged etc and all disputes must be took into consideration.
He's not being arsey, just underhand. We've tried to talk it all thriough with him and explain our concerns and then he just applies to build onto our garage anyway.
Who do you lodge your dispute tho? as the planning department aren't interested.
knock your garage down, see what he does then.
LOL it might come to that :cooter:
*Yellow*
28-08-2009, 07:44
its our wall on our land.
Is your garage inside the boundary?
If so.... he cant build on your land, even touch your property come to that.
Thats why there are boundaries, which stop this happening.
i can not see him being able to build, citizens advice is your best first call, take everything with you plans etc, sometimes they are hard work.
Is it just his garden currently or does he park there. I would try and get a compromise maybe a new electric door for your garage :).
As for selling your house it would not put me off, should only take a few weeks.
Move on, and forget about it.
Neighbours can be hell.
phil
Chris Hebden
28-08-2009, 08:58
Is your garage inside the boundary?
If so.... he cant build on your land, even touch your property come to that.
Thats why there are boundaries, which stop this happening.
:agree:
The planning department DO look at the surrounding area and if he is proposing to build onto your land then there has to be a written consent from your side via a solicitor, incorporated into the submission. It might even have the to be written into a Section 106 agreement depending on how your authority works.
One thing to look at mate is if his submitted drawings show his new buidling tieing into yours i.e. via brick work or is he putting an external wall up against yours. It all hangs on what these drawing show matey
Penfold aka The Dealer
28-08-2009, 11:15
Ask him for £5k and you will allow him to use ur wall/property...
The proposal submitted t the council is as follows.
"Erection of single-storey garage attached to gable elevation of garage at no. 100 Melbeck Drive."
My house is number 100.
The yellow blob shows his house, the one to the RHS is mine. The red box is his drive and land next to my garage.
http://www.rtoc.org/boards/picture.php?albumid=552&pictureid=8240
The google map below shows it better. The red box is his land and the burgandy peugeot is on his drive. The blue clio is in front of my garage.
http://www.rtoc.org/boards/picture.php?albumid=552&pictureid=8239
-----------
Chris, who will ask me for written consent? Does my neighbour have to ask? I spoke to the planning officer in charge of this yesterday and she lead me to believe that they wouldn't?
Ask him for £5k and you will allow him to use ur wall/property...
That’s the thing, he's never offered anything. He hasn’t even said he would put his old gear on and help us move our shed and empty the garage etc... He's just assumed we will bear the brunt of the inconvenience out of the kindness of our hearts!
the neighbour is probably trying to get his own back, because of all those pikey cars parked outside your house:)
TNT Tricky Nicky
28-08-2009, 13:16
One of my friends dads had a similar problem when he wanted to build a garage, wasn't next to another garage but a wall he had built to establise boundarys, he wanted to use the exsisting Walls as a wall for the garage but was told he had to leave a 300mm gap between the wall and garage by the planning officer due to building on the boundary of the property, surely this would also apply to you as he will be building effectively right on the boundary, ie your garage?
Is your garage wall on the boundary line at all, is it right on the line, if it is then he by rights as long as he does not effect the structure strength can use the wall as part of his build as the wall has been built on the boundary line, if it is not on the line and is only slightly inside the boundary then he has no given right to use it.
Friend had the same issue and was told if you do not want the third party to use the wall then move the wall off the boundary line.
The bigger issue is where he is looking to tie into your way and roof, you could enforce that no damage is made to your building.
One of my friends dads had a similar problem when he wanted to build a garage, wasn't next to another garage but a wall he had built to establise boundarys, he wanted to use the exsisting Walls as a wall for the garage but was told he had to leave a 300mm gap between the wall and garage by the planning officer due to building on the boundary of the property, surely this would also apply to you as he will be building effectively right on the boundary, ie your garage?
Yes thats fine as long as the garage is not also on the boundary line at present.
Mudslinger
28-08-2009, 13:26
does any other houses in the street have the same layout with 2 garages ?
Maybe worth having a look or chat .
im guessing that if he has to build the 3 walls it would put his garage into the grass area that is out of his land so he has to tie into your garage to get the size right ?
Chris Hebden
28-08-2009, 15:15
Chris, who will ask me for written consent? Does my neighbour have to ask? I spoke to the planning officer in charge of this yesterday and she lead me to believe that they wouldn't?
The planners should request this. If they dont and i were you i would contact building control and see if they have been consolted. If they havent they will definately be interested because of the fire risk to your home and general drainage requirements as part of the bulding regulations.
If none of this works i would formally write to the planners stating that you are against the proposal, saying something along the lines of there has been no agreement between yourself and the 1st party to dismantle and reconstruct your garage.
does any other houses in the street have the same layout with 2 garages ?
Maybe worth having a look or chat .
im guessing that if he has to build the 3 walls it would put his garage into the grass area that is out of his land so he has to tie into your garage to get the size right ?
Exactly right, if he doesnt use our wall and has to leave a gap between the our wall and his new wall he wont have the width to build a garage wide enough to fit a car into!
So its use our wall or nothing (unless he can buy land off the council)!
*Yellow*
28-08-2009, 17:55
Exactly right, if he doesnt use our wall and has to leave a gap between the our wall and his new wall he wont have the width to build a garage wide enough to fit a car into!
So its use our wall or nothing (unless he can buy land off the council)!
Its nothing then..... as your not willing to let him touch YOUR property.
Here is the plan of our land ownership from HM Land Registry
http://www.rtoc.org/boards/picture.php?albumid=552&pictureid=8241
I guess he could argue our wall is on the boundry line? :scratch:
I would definately have a word with your neighbour, keeping the peace could be enough to keep the building site away till you sell the house? Or look at it as a plus, security wise it would make getting round to you back garden harder? Or is that just the photos being decieving?
Idealy i'd love too mate but its all about the equity... We looked into buy to let mortgages on this house but we need the equity as a deposit on the next house. Lenders wont give you a decent rate on your mortgage unless you have a 25% deposit!!!
He's not being arsey, just underhand. We've tried to talk it all thriough with him and explain our concerns and then he just applies to build onto our garage anyway.
Who do you lodge your dispute tho? as the planning department aren't interested.
LOL it might come to that :cooter:
dont know what equity u have in the house or what kind of money u want to spend on your new one but its worth looking further into m8 and try and make it work... you wont regret it....
Chris Hebden
29-08-2009, 09:00
Ash, what does it say in your title deeds, that should state what defines your boundary line!? If its the wall then i would be getting involved with building control and the planners if its not then he can jog on!
Ash, what does it say in your title deeds, that should state what defines your boundary line!? If its the wall then i would be getting involved with building control and the planners if its not then he can jog on!
I don't know mate, I think our mortgage company keep the title deeds? or is it the solicitors? I dont think we get a copy until the house is paid off and fully owned by us?
Chris Hebden
29-08-2009, 09:07
You should have a copy at least i would have thought. Our family home was never paid off yet we had the title deeds. Mum had to produce them to the estate agents when she wanted them to sell the house.
TrixNFlix
29-08-2009, 09:09
I don't know mate, I think our mortgage company keep the title deeds? or is it the solicitors? I dont think we get a copy until the house is paid off and fully owned by us?
I don't know I'd there has been a change in the law but I have had a morgage for a year now and I have all the title deeds. The solicitors past them straight on to us when the sale was completed.
oh right, interesting, I'll go have a look through all my docs in the loft!!
oh right, interesting, I'll go have a look through all my docs in the loft!!
Sounds like you`ll have to go in the loft anyway before the builders move in and piss under the rot wool :eek: hope you sort it. If not use the old fashion method of violence i.e. a quiet word in his ear! Though I wouldn’t condone this liable and irresponsible approach :tuttut: (kick his F**kin head in!)
Mudslinger
29-08-2009, 12:38
looking at this pic http://www.rtoc.org/boards/album.php?albumid=574&pictureid=6002
it wont make that much diff to your garage wont have to remove that much brick to tie into the butts , just insist it be identicle or it would just look odd attached to your property , will the proposed garage have the same roof as yours ? it does look like your out of your boundaries a tad .
Chris Hebden
29-08-2009, 12:51
Yea not many will be removed if at all as he will probably lay the beams on to the existing wall plate, BUT its all about how the roof trusses are connected and the fire proofing. It all depends on what his plans show for the planning application
Ash, what does it say in your title deeds, that should state what defines your boundary line!? If its the wall then i would be getting involved with building control and the planners if its not then he can jog on!
The deeds are written in such a way that only legal boffins can decipher it... I've had a read but it makes no sense!!
Skizz it over and I'll take a look for you. On holiday next week mind.
what do you need Tom, a copy of the deeds?
Ashy, my boss buys plots and puts new build houses on, he has a soliciter who only deals with party wall agreements, boundaries etc. I can speak to him to get a contact number if that's any help to you.
The last thing you need is something built which then affects you selling your property, a major problem occurs as a result of this build.
I can speak to him to get a contact number if that's any help to you.
If you could mate :)
I'm no expert, but surely he can't just join a building onto your property?....It's daft, but isn't it like him building a conservatory that joins onto your house?....ie, bang out of order?
The answer from rogue garage man's point of view would surely be to build his garage near to, but not actually touching your garage?
Even then, you could kick up a stink and say that you were going to instal a window in your garage and now you can't etc.
I work for a local authority, and if you can hang on until tomorrow (today actually, just looked at the clock!), I can ask someone in the planning dept. for an opinion and advice.
My girlfriend has a similar "neighbourly" problem at the moment, she has a shared drive.....not a problem in itself, but she shares it with Wayne and Waynetta Slob who have six hundred kids running up and down the side of her house on bikes, roller skates, skateboards etc.......might sound trivial, but it isn't when you're stuck with it!:mad:
knock your garage down, see what he does then.
rofl, or just chin him
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