View Full Version : Reno 16v Engines F7 range, conversion info required
Hi chaps, I'm after information on the older range of Renault 16v engines that came in the Reno Clio 16v, Renault 19 16v & Renault Megane Coupe etc. The way I understand it there was the 1.8 16v F7p? the 2.0 16v Willy engine and a 2.0 16v Coupe Engine?
Firstly can anyone tell me the engine codes, sizes and stock power outputs?
Also If I were thinking of doing a transplant into a gtt as cheaply as possible which one would be the best to go for? I'm not too worried about the cost to get hold of the engine (I should be able to sort this fairly cheaply) but more things such as the exhaust manifold, is this something you have to buy off BB tuning or are there any diesel engines which have a t2 flanged manifold and the same mounting pattern as the petrol heads?
Also are the injetors on this range of engines the standard bosch size injectors, same as cossie type ones?
Have those of you that use the F7P Turbos dropped the compresion? If so by how much?
Any other info would be great!!
Cheers Ashy
Matt@CodeRedMotorsports
07-01-2009, 21:12
Try the 16valver site, many conversions done by the guys there.........
As a rough guide....1.8 16v Clio and R19 = F7P...137bhp. and Williams 2.0 and Megane 2.0 = F7R...150bhp.
Andrew Cooke
07-01-2009, 21:21
I recall something about the R19 plenum fitting nicely under the GTT bonnet. Might be a false memory though :laugh:
What a great topic. I like it already.;)
I haven't seen much in the way of details on the conversion but people obviously do them
£££ http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/RENAULT-F7P-1-8-16V-TURBO-ENGINE-CLIO-5-GT-TURBO-19-NEW_W0QQitemZ110333813200QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Car sParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item110333813200&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A3%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318
Picking up a renault 19 complete car would be easiest to go for. They fit straight in with change of engine mount, and fits nicely in there with no changing of the bonnet
Ive got my C/R down to about 8.0:1 however, some people have just skimmed 1mm off the original pistons and that worked fine, upto 10psi or so. Or just put the plate between head and block to change it. Different ways of doing that.
If looking at turbo conversion, just used BB manifold to mount the turbo. Else can make your own.
That engine on eBay looks expensive for a 2nd hand engine which has not had much done to it apart from small bits from cars chucked together and few bits from BB
Matt@CodeRedMotorsports
07-01-2009, 22:12
I recall something about the R19 plenum fitting nicely under the GTT bonnet. Might be a false memory though :laugh:
The R19 16v inlet is a teensie bit longer than the Clio one near the throttle housing....thats the only real difference.
Yeah, been having a read on the clio16v site, seems that the 1.8 engines have under piston sprays where as the 2.0 engine doesn't? Not sure if thats true or not tho?
Seems that on the 1.8's there are two setups, the stock compression and up to 10psi boost and low compression by machining pistons and running 20+ psi.
Some people seem to make up to 350hp... Again not sure if thats true or not?
Dale, you say get the manifold from BB, is it their own custom made manifolds or are they from another engine?
It's their own design. not from another car. problem being is that there is not much space behind the block to get the turbo in. the log manifold in place a t28 turbo will just fit in. Only problem being that not sure if BB are still making them, might be lucky on eBay or speaking to them if you go that route. As for 350bhp id take that with a pinch of salt like most rolling road readings.
With current spec of mine it was 180bhp at 6psi but still managed to tune it more after the original set up on the rolling road, they were very poor in mapping it, ran like a bag of S**T. Should be seeing if I can get more from it this month if I can get it to the rolling road.
Not sure if I want to run anymore than 1bar from the conversion, but guess ill wait and see how it drives.
You got yet another R5 Niall??
Whats your compression? Is it just stock?
Are you running an aftermarket ECU or can you map the Clio ECU to any extent?
You got yet another R5 Niall??
Nah mate, don't have the time or inclination, just gathering some info for Rob (v-man) we were having a chat about it earlier over a cuppa!
Whats your compression? Is it just stock?
Are you running an aftermarket ECU or can you map the Clio ECU to any extent?
Spec is on my profile, easier than typing it out :)
Spec is on my profile, easier than typing it out :)
Nice one, pretty fancy then :) Are you pleased with it?
Nice one, pretty fancy then :) Are you pleased with it?
When its on the road, im very please with it. Great running with just 180bhp, felt more alive than the C1J engine, plus handling felt better with a slightly more heavy engine, but could also be that I renewed everything up front and semi-seam welded the subframe. Driven it about 4k miles so far since being on the road, some set back with fan problems and fueling which caused the head gasket to go, but thats my fault with playing with the fueling when its very cold outside. But standard headgasket held fine, so if it does go wrong it doesn't cost a fortune to sort out each time. Still more things to sort out when I up the power but I knew it was going to be a gradual process as money was always going to be the object. But brings a smile when you see those £30k cars cant accelerate away from you and your right behind them :)
Rob@Backyardracing
07-01-2009, 23:29
I beleave you can use 1.8 8V (poss RSI) or summet? pistons to lower the compression more so than a skimmed piston i cant confirm CR or that fact as gospal, if i was you id also see which has more tapper as that will help with big boost. Dont think ive seen a std alone ecu one yet could be wrong? Id say the F7P be the better as a turbo lump as cheaper if it went wrong as these lump cost pennys... Ive heard of 400bhp ones but i cant confirm this either untill a see a nice trap down the old sticky track...:)
Rob@Backyardracing
07-01-2009, 23:31
Yep ive found a std alone one now.... Mr bigfoot ;)
Yep ive found a std alone one now.... Mr bigfoot ;)
Let me know where you find one ;)
Once running right, ill be taking it up pod, see how long the clutch lasts really. But I didn't have this car done for pod, nor for track, just a fun toy for any use I feel like it. One reason why I didn't choose a lot bigger turbo to destoy the cars looks to get a nice front mount on it. Nice and original looking now for more of a surpise when I overtake them :laugh:
Could possibly use pistons from the RSI, didn't look that much into it, as went for Wossner ones.
BBs was supposed to be running 400bhp or so, but they were using the r-tuner map so very limited on tuning capabilites.
BB won't have had 400hp :)
BB won't have had 400hp :)
Yeah I know that, its what they said they had :laugh: previous message which I put was take it with a pinch of salt.
I dont care what power im running, as long as im happy with it, who cares :D
rob, blocky (pervy mechanic) has done various incarnations of f7p and f7r 16v turbos running DTA.
i l k e r
08-01-2009, 11:39
Ashy,
willy engine also got the under piston oil sprays mate :agree:
Adey aka Ewok
08-01-2009, 12:19
i wounder if you could use te volvo f block turbo bottom end with a 16v head? already low comp? could be a nice hybrid lump to go in a 5
i wounder if you could use te volvo f block turbo bottom end with a 16v head? already low comp? could be a nice hybrid lump to go in a 5
that wont work i am afraid :crap:
I'm pretty sure you cannot do this as the Heads are configured differently (Scoff will give you a technical explanation).
On those lines though could you not fit the pistons from the volvo f block and stick them in the f7p and they would be the low comp ones for a turbo.
Unlikely I will end up with both engines in the garage at the same time but you get the idea?
Adey aka Ewok
08-01-2009, 13:06
thats cool, was just a thought, piston swap should be good tho
i wounder if you could use te volvo f block turbo bottom end with a 16v head? already low comp? could be a nice hybrid lump to go in a 5
I'm sure blocky has done this, 8v 2.0l volvo lump with a 16v clio head. From what I remember it involved welding and machining oil galleries though!
Welding alloy oil galleries! :eek:
Sounds like a ballache!
Is this a BB manifold I wonder?
http://www.robertruthadventure.co.uk/renault%205/16%20v%20turbo/manifold.jpg
No mate, thats a tubular one, the BB one is cast!!
That looks hand made, not sure about the turbo being that way round though, could be interesting with where the boost circuit goes and also the exhuast, mines the oposite way round to that
Looks the same as this one, pics taken from Cliosport
http://www.rtoc.org/boards/picture.php?albumid=390&pictureid=3610
http://www.rtoc.org/boards/picture.php?albumid=390&pictureid=3609
http://www.rtoc.org/boards/picture.php?albumid=390&pictureid=3608
http://www.rtoc.org/boards/picture.php?albumid=390&pictureid=3607
http://www.rtoc.org/boards/picture.php?albumid=390&pictureid=3606
http://www.rtoc.org/boards/picture.php?albumid=390&pictureid=3605
all he has said is its a T3 flanged manifold off e-bay!
Ahh, wonder who made those, doesn't look like those from that italian company. Other thing, thats going to be tight squeeze if putting in the 5, not that much room there.
Yeah. Looking at those clio pictures, you would have a job fitting it to a 5.
It does look home made though, you're right Ashmeister:)
Mr Bigfoot do you have any more pics of your engine with the manifold that fits in a Renault 5??
Woznaldo
08-01-2009, 20:27
This is the Log Manifold for the F7P/R
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa40/woznaldo/Alliance%20Manifold/T3LogManifold.jpg
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa40/woznaldo/Alliance%20Manifold/T3LogManifold2.jpg
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa40/woznaldo/Alliance%20Manifold/T3LogManifold3.jpg
The bottom two show fitment to a GTT.
Taken from the Williamsclio site (classifieds I think)
Blimey, that home made manifold looks prety simple to make, 2 bends 3 straights and and 2 laser cut flanges!!
Cheers Woz. Good pictures:)
That manifold looks really simple! Would it fit a 5? Probably wants to be coming around the side of the block rather than at the back.
It looks like most of the 16v boys use the Wosner Pistons that are about £400 so need a cheaper alternative such as giving them a shave or use pistons from other cars as stated above.
Yeah. Looking at those clio pictures, you would have a job fitting it to a 5.
It does look home made though, you're right Ashmeister:)
Mr Bigfoot do you have any more pics of your engine with the manifold that fits in a Renault 5??
Just going to upload all the pictures I can find on the computer.
All uploaded of the pics I have found. Turbo on it is not the one which is currently on there, thats a T2.
Pictures are in my profile
Thanks mate:)
I will have a good look at those pics. Did you run it with a T2 and if so what was it like!?
Thanks mate:)
I will have a good look at those pics. Did you run it with a T2 and if so what was it like!?
Never ran it with the T2, the GT28RS I have spoils up like a T2 on the C1J, pulls all the way to 6.5k thats where my limiter is at, thats even in 5th gear :D
Never ran it with the T2, the GT28RS I have spoils up like a T2 on the C1J, pulls all the way to 6.5k thats where my limiter is at, thats even in 5th gear :D
OK,OK you have convinced me!:)
I have a T28 lying around waiting for something so I don't need to worry about that.
Manifold is probably the main thing. I like the idea of spares being available for these engines aswell.
OK,OK you have convinced me!:)
Good good :) just need to start the work :D
Yup. I just need to get my engine man get his finger out and find me something;)
I am keeping my eyes peeled for a whole car to -difficult when I have 4 cars at the moment :ashamed:
..........there's always room for one more!
Best thing is to find a Renault 19 16v, can pick them up for a couple hundred quid. Then sell on some parts and scrap the rest. Leather seats still get a fair bit of money :)
Whats wrong with 4 cars :laugh: I have 4 cars as well :crap:
First post!
Hello ppl,been quite some time since i was last on here. On the old site both myself and Mart discussed this engine conversion in detail.I will have to find all the info and put up.
I was tinking about doing this conversion again,and was wondering as the 1.8 volvo engine is a F series engine could you use the crank,conrods,pistons,or even just the pistons. BB's Bluey had 250 bhp at 1 bar i belived,they used the 1.8 bottom end with a 2 litre head bigger valves.
BB's Bluey had 250 bhp at 1 bar i belived,they used the 1.8 bottom end with a 2 litre head bigger valves.
I thought theirs was a complete williams engine then turbo converted. I know they were using the williams JC5 box with it.
If it is what you said it is then ive got the same engine roughly, except mines not the 2.0 head but has the williams valves and also ported and polished to a mm of its life. Im hoping that it has made a lot of difference compared to the standard head. Should have done really.
New poster! (less than 10 posts)
No m8 they used the williams box as they said it was stronger.
New poster! (less than 10 posts)
No m8 they used the williams box as they said it was stronger.
I know the JC5 is stronger, thats why I have the JC5 from the 172 :)
New poster! (less than 10 posts)
I know the JC5 is stronger, thats why I have the JC5 from the 172 :)
Yes M8 thats the box i woul use.Its the strongest you can use with that engine i belive.
New poster! (less than 10 posts)
Yes M8 thats the box i woul use.Its the strongest you can use with that engine i belive.
Maybe Scoff can spread some light on whats he done about his Gearbox issues :)
Maybe Scoff can spread some light on whats he done about his Gearbox issues :)
Gone German!!
Rob, Karen was over today to see the baby, I've given her a list of engines to pass on to Ian, should hopefully hear something today / tomorrow! :smokin:
Gone German!!
Remember reading somewhere that he has done that. Gather he has gone for a 5sp box, any troubles with space as its rather close with my 172 box, or has he moved the engine around a bit to fit it all in.
Rob, Karen was over today to see the baby, I've given her a list of engines to pass on to Ian, should hopefully hear something today / tomorrow! :smokin:[/quote]
:D
Ya Beauty. Better stick a JC5 on the shopping list. Might even be better snaffling a whole car! :eek:
Scott. Would be good if you could dig out some bedtime reading info.....
First post!
Hello ppl,been quite some time since i was last on here. On the old site both myself and Mart discussed this engine conversion in detail.I will have to find all the info and put up.
I was tinking about doing this conversion again,and was wondering as the 1.8 volvo engine is a F series engine could you use the crank,conrods,pistons,or even just the pistons. BB's Bluey had 250 bhp at 1 bar i belived,they used the 1.8 bottom end with a 2 litre head bigger valves.
The volvo engine is an F-block of kinds, volvo tag it up b18ft. the crank is the same, goes right in. rods and pistons are not. rods are shorter and pistons are smaller at 81mm in the volvo.
BB's way is a good route, 250hp at 1 bar is pretty easy too on a good tune.
Adey aka Ewok
10-01-2009, 09:14
how much shorter are the rods?
Adey aka Ewok
12-01-2009, 09:41
bumpo 4 anyone in the know
Pervy Mechanic
12-01-2009, 18:24
First post!
I'm sure blocky has done this, 8v 2.0l volvo lump with a 16v clio head. From what I remember it involved welding and machining oil galleries though!
Aye lad, been there done that one, and ure rite m8 , there was welding of the oil drains and drilling out new ones. i stillhave a converted head lying around if someone wants a do. !! ?? ;-)
Rob, I've currently got a f7p motor running with 8v rsi pistons in. 1mm machined off tops to clear valves, and rebored to suit the bore increase. using 16v rods as they are stronger means there is no way of securing the gudgeon pins into the pistons due to piston differences. we got round it by machinin some teflon buttons up to fit inside the gudgeon pins ;-) If you havin a go at building one, i'll be about if you want any more info.
Good one Blocky:)
Where you not tempted to just lower the compression on the standard 16v pistons i.e. taking some off the tops?
Why the trouble of the rsi and then taking 1m off? I suppose I'm just looking for the easiset route to do it mate and of course whack a turbo on:cool:
Pervy Mechanic
14-01-2009, 01:07
New poster! (less than 10 posts)
Good one Blocky:)
Where you not tempted to just lower the compression on the standard 16v pistons i.e. taking some off the tops?
Why the trouble of the rsi and then taking 1m off? I suppose I'm just looking for the easiset route to do it mate and of course whack a turbo on:cool:
I only used rsi pistons because i had a set of new ones floating about !! And i suppose to see if it worked ! It would be much easier as u say, to machine the standard valver pistons. :cool:
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