View Full Version : Red or blue coolant?
Nottswoody
04-04-2012, 15:10
What's the difference and benifits?
markey b
04-04-2012, 16:14
iirc blue/green is glycol
red is some organic (oat) business
i use red, just my preference, its never in long enough to worry about lifespan :laugh:
SCHWARTZ
04-04-2012, 17:51
Ethelene glycol (excuse spelling) is what the book says to use but doubt it matters.
I personally wouldn't run red coolant in a C1J, and definitely wouldn't if mixing it with left-over green/blue that's still within the system.
The o.e Renault green stuff is spot on - That's all I've ever ran in my GTT's/trackday use. Even the Jap taxi likes it :D
It doesn't matter which colour you use. I'd avoid mixing it though if you can....
Nottswoody
04-04-2012, 19:03
Went with blue as Carl told me lynchstar.. Plus the new rad from robbo she's running sweet and nice and cool my rad really was knackerd!! Next job t25 off blunty :-) she will be boosting for summer.. My mrs HATES the 5 :cooter:
olidaviesuk
04-04-2012, 19:04
The green Renault premixed stuff is spot on, never had any problems with overheating with it and doubt many cars get as much abuse and potential for rising temps as mine!
I personally wouldn't run red coolant in a C1J, and definitely wouldn't if mixing it with left-over green/blue that's still within the system.
The o.e Renault green stuff is spot on - That's all I've ever ran in my GTT's/trackday use. Even the Jap taxi likes it :D
The green Renault premixed stuff is spot on, never had any problems with overheating with it and doubt many cars get as much abuse and potential for rising temps as mine!
:agree:
Slightly off track of the original question, but how much is the OE Renault stuff?
olidaviesuk
04-04-2012, 19:22
About £20 for 5 litres premixed - more than enough for a cup spec cooling system, doubt a standard gtt system holds more than another half a litre or so... So should be enough for a std car...
Slightly off track of the original question, but how much is the OE Renault stuff?
i heard that the red stuff eats copper core rads..
http://www.rtoc.org/boards/showthread.php?t=22824&highlight=Coolant
;)
Slightly off track of the original question, but how much is the OE Renault stuff?
Bought some today - it was 12 quid mate. :agree:
jamie_clioGTT
06-04-2012, 12:54
Just a quick question whilst on this subject..
How affective is anti freeze when it comes to cooling? I've always run with it but I've had a few problems of late and the temp sits around 2 notches higher without it.. Would no anti freeze be making it run higher temps or do you think I have another underlined problem?
Sorry for the thread jack.
Dave Reed
06-04-2012, 13:18
Might not cure it, but it's cooling properties are better than water. You should always run anti freeze anyway.
i heard that the red stuff eats copper core rads..
You hear wrong ;)
Taken from that other thread.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
There are two basic types of coolant available today dependent on the corrosion inhibitors used:
·inorganic additive technology (IAT)
·organic additive technology (OAT)
Inorganic Additive Technology
This is the traditional coolant based on inorganic additives and is called inorganic additive technology (IAT). It is a tried and proven chemistry that provides a fast acting protective film. The additives deplete and the coolant needs to be drained and replenished every couple of years. This type can be used on all mixed metal engines with components including steel, cast iron, copper, brass, aluminium and solder without any detrimental effect.
Organic Acid Technology
The newer OAT coolants work differently than the older silicate based IAT coolants. Aluminium and ferrous metals form a surface-layer of corrosion in the presence of moisture, even with the little bit of moisture in the air. OAT coolants prevent this metal-oxide layer that protects the surface against this corrosion. Inherent with their design, the OAT coolants last longer than the older traditional IAT coolants. This category of antifreeze cannot be used in systems containing yellow metals.
Why are coolants different colours?
Coolants/antifreezes are coloured so you can visually see them; colour intensity can be an indication of over dilution. The different colours are non specific to the different types of antifreeze. The manufacturer can dye the product any colour they want. The colour is no guide to the actual type of antifreeze type and the label should be read before use.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yellow metal:
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/yellow+metal
http://www.blackburnsmetals.com/products-yellow-metals.html
Difficult to find out if copper alone is classed as a 'yellow metal'. Going on the second link it would seem that it is. In that case it would make sense to listen to Mart et al and only use IAT based antifreeze (whatever colour the manufacturer has decided to dye it). If nothing else, avoid OAT as it is at best unclear if it causes problems in a C1J. Of course staying away from copper cored rads is another age old RTOC tip.
Alex, a winky face doesn't really help educate members. If you can put links to things that support what you're saying it helps add credence to your comments. At the moment it doesn't look like the winking face was correct on the copper cored rad eating score, although it does seem you're right on the colour front.
Sorry Trev I haven't got any links to support what I'm saying, I speaking from experience of using several tyoes of coolant over the years. The winky face was supposed to be a "read between the lines" wink. Never mind.
For clarification I'm currently using red coolant (G12 I beleive) and its been in there about 18 months or so. It's been used both on the road and on track with a copper cored radiator and it's been fine. I've used blue in the past and that was fine also...... :)
Ive used the blue antifreeze/summer coolant for years with no problems...make sure the mix is correct. The renault coolant is ok but my nearest dealer is about ten mile away and the motorfactors is one mile away...
Sorry Trev I haven't got any links to support what I'm saying, I speaking from experience of using several tyoes of coolant over the years. The winky face was supposed to be a "read between the lines" wink. Never mind.
For clarification I'm currently using red coolant (G12 I beleive) and its been in there about 18 months or so. It's been used both on the road and on track with a copper cored radiator and it's been fine. I've used blue in the past and that was fine also...... :)
i asked this question a while ago..the general opinion i got was that the pink coolant has caused leaks in copper core rads and heater matrix's. i used the blue coolant with no problems.
maybe the people that have had bad experiences with the pink coolant can expand in this thread.
FFS guys. Have another read:
Why are coolants different colours?
Coolants/antifreezes are coloured so you can visually see them; colour intensity can be an indication of over dilution. The different colours are non specific to the different types of antifreeze. The manufacturer can dye the product any colour they want. The colour is no guide to the actual type of antifreeze type and the label should be read before use.
Nottswoody
07-04-2012, 23:00
:ashamed: I won't ever ask that question again :cooter:
Tony Walker
08-04-2012, 08:29
water cooled egr valves on the vauxhalls have yellow metal outlet pipes and come with red antifreeze from factory? i say get the blue stuff only because its slightly cheaper. Ive had the red stuff in my 5 for about 8 months but i did remove my copper rad for an alloy one. Coolants still nice and clear and i certainly cant see any evidence of a reaction from the heater matrix. (pretty sure mines original and 20+ years old so chances are its due to pop anyway lol)
The heater matrix is alluminium anyway isn't it? :confused:
It couldn't be any more plain. The colour makes no difference, it's just a feckin' dye. What's important is whether the antifreeze is OAT or IAT (organic or inorganic).
Stick whatever colour you want in as long as it is IAT (i.e. as per Renault o.e.).
Do not put OAT in, whatever the colour, because there's a chance it will screw your engine.
Why take the risk :rolleyes:
We need a face plant smiley for RTOC.
:laugh: Was waiting for you to post again :D
Tony Walker
08-04-2012, 09:45
It couldn't be any more plain. The colour makes no difference, it's just a feckin' dye. What's important is whether the antifreeze is OAT or IAT (organic or inorganic).
Stick whatever colour you want in as long as it is IAT (i.e. as per Renault o.e.).
Do not put OAT in, whatever the colour, because there's a chance it will screw your engine.
Why take the risk :rolleyes:
We need a face plant smiley for RTOC.
screw your engine...... load of rubbish. 99.9% the red coolant is OAT. And will make no difference anyway.
andybond
08-04-2012, 09:45
Trev can I use tartan OAT coolant? Or is stripy Iat ok for my car?
gttjames
08-04-2012, 09:59
wow alot going on in here
I use pink, looks nice and clean.
just dont mix it with different colour or it looks horrible
*sigh* I'll have another go :scared: The red G12 coolant I'm using is the more modern stuff and it's been fine in my car and also Tonys by the sound of it. It won't ruin the engine - why would it? The question mark is over whether it screws up copper radiators? As mentioned I've been using one for years and it's been fine. You can't go by colour as mentioned but generally red is OAT.
Going back to what I originally said; it doesn't matter what colour/spec you use just avoid mixing it..... :D
Why would it ruin the engine? That's already been answered.
Assuming the "modern G12 stuff" you're running is OAT as described then to repeat:
Organic Acid Technology
The newer OAT coolants work differently than the older silicate based IAT coolants. Aluminium and ferrous metals form a surface-layer of corrosion in the presence of moisture, even with the little bit of moisture in the air. OAT coolants prevent this metal-oxide layer that protects the surface against this corrosion. Inherent with their design, the OAT coolants last longer than the older traditional IAT coolants. This category of antifreeze cannot be used in systems containing yellow metals.
Are you're sure there's no yellow metals in your C1J Alex? Maybe you're right, maybe it doesn't affect the C1J but why would members take the risk when the correct stuff is widely available?
I guess there's nothing else to say here on either side, other members are able to see everyone's comments.
screw your engine...... load of rubbish. 99.9% the red coolant is OAT. And will make no difference anyway.
Still yet to find anyone providing any independent sources/links or information to give any insight as to why OAT wont affect the C1J. As for the colour debate, that's been a 'red' herring since the start.
Andy - you can only put tartan OAT in if you live north of the border, obviously.
:laugh: wot a silly debate :cooter:
I doubt after 25 years of mixing and ' **** that'll do ' servicing it makes much difference .Sure, on a new engine/car best to start out with and stick to a certain type but from what I've seen inside and around the pots on numerous lumps I won't be losing much sleep over it .
Only one guy I know has had his car from almost new and always uses premix Renault Glycol ...his system is pristine :coffee:
GTA suffers more than most as there are two 3m long steel pipes front to rear then ali block ......
http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z110/cleetav6/Andy001/IMG_0498.jpg
Although I did read somewhere that mixing can result in a build up of ' jelly ' in the system and cause blockages :coffee:
:brickwall: I give up. I'm going to eat Easter eggs! :D
Nottswoody
08-04-2012, 18:39
Bet your all glad I started this thread off ha ha!! :coffee:
Who gives a ****. Run what ever you like, if it makes the engine run hot or fail you will know not to do it again.
What a load of waffle
LYNCHSTAR
08-04-2012, 20:19
blue.
If you don't give a **** about this, whether or not your engine fails because of it, what's the point giving a **** about anything.
With the constant endless waffle on here from members about utter GTT minutia, I'm surprised this thread's being picked out for special treatment.
I appreciate Clee's input.
"Only one guy I know has had his car from almost new and always uses premix Renault Glycol ...his system is pristine."
"I did read somewhere that mixing can result in a build up of 'jelly' in the system and cause blockages."
With so many members spending so much time on restorations, they deserve the best advice.
I'm surprised no ones mentioned purple yet! :D
Green.
:laugh:
:brickwall: Lol
TNT Tricky Nicky
08-04-2012, 22:32
I've always used pre mixed coolant as I've seen what damage incorrect dilutions and mixing coolant types can do to internal coolant paths.
I use to work for a john deere dealership and they had two engines which had been cut in half, one was ran on john deere oil and premixed coolant the other on generic oil and a water mixed coolant, one looked like new and one looked like clees photo.
I blew a coolant hose when out once and did an on the road repair, luckily i was near a petrol station so brought what they had available, was red, which is irrelevant, but out of laziness and knowing that the car was ran on whatever before i brought it i left it in thinking I'd change it at some point, a couple of months later my copper rad turned into a sieve, connected? maybe, maybe not.
when my engine has been acid dipped and rebuilt i know what I'll be using
If you don't give a **** about this, whether or not your engine fails because of it, what's the point giving a **** about anything.
With the constant endless waffle on here from members about utter GTT minutia, I'm surprised this thread's being picked out for special treatment.
I appreciate Clee's input.
"Only one guy I know has had his car from almost new and always uses premix Renault Glycol ...his system is pristine."
"I did read somewhere that mixing can result in a build up of 'jelly' in the system and cause blockages."
With so many members spending so much time on restorations, they deserve the best advice.
Got my rise in blood pressure and spitting coffee at computer response. Trev chill buddy didn't think I'd trap you in my net... ;)
Btw I've used the blue halfords gear before, well for years in my red 5 with no issues, once neat for 6 months it ran coooool. Since then with other 5's and the current it's the Renault gear, it looks fabby in the new header
olidaviesuk
08-04-2012, 23:01
Can't belive this post is still going on..... Comes down to 2 things:
1. People can't get the renault o.e. spec coolant and want to source a good alternative - fine most motor factors will be able to source a suitable alternative regardless of the colour of the rainbow it happens to be... They are all much of a muchness (other than the manufacturers dye that's put in to colour it)
2. People don't wanna spend £ on a decent coolant and want a 'cheap' alternative.... In which case I firmly suggest you go and buy a ford fiesta or the like (not that I have anything against fords btw...)
Can't belive this post is still going on..... Comes down to 2 things:
1. People can't get the renault o.e. spec coolant and want to source a good alternative - fine most motor factors will be able to source a suitable alternative regardless of the colour of the rainbow it happens to be... They are all much of a muchness (other than the manufacturers dye that's put in to colour it)
2. People don't wanna spend £ on a decent coolant and want a 'cheap' alternative.... In which case I firmly suggest you go and buy a ford fiesta or the like (not that I have anything against fords btw...)
LOL if you have a worry about the price of coolant, then driving and fuel prices might send you to the looney bin :laugh: in that case FORD it up
*For clarity not directed at you olly just in general*
Tony Walker
08-04-2012, 23:46
Coolants pretty expensive :( concentrate we get 25 litres for around £45 ish quid. The amount of times ive knocked the jug over too :cry: and when its your money dripping down the drain... hurts. more expensive than fully synth oil.
It does strike me as being pretty expensive these days. I remember when I started driving it was next to nothing. Oil seems to be going the other way, fully synthetic used to be really pricey but now it's not so bad and result available.
Now where were we?
Ah yes, red it blue! :D
Tony Walker
08-04-2012, 23:51
yeah 5w30 fs very cheap now.
Think i saw someone mention blue coolant in a red car before :eek:
Coolants pretty expensive :( concentrate we get 25 litres for around £45 ish quid. The amount of times ive knocked the jug over too :cry: and when its your money dripping down the drain... hurts. more expensive than fully synth oil.
Yeah all part of car ownership, things cost money to maintain and keep running correctly. Think a saying that could run here is ''if you cant do the time dont do the crime'' lol.
But careless spills tony ... thats just nasty:cry:
Tony Walker
08-04-2012, 23:53
lol yeah, so is leaving sump plug out and pouring 5 liters of oil with nothing on the dipstick and thinking hmmmmmmm im sure this only takes 4.2ltrs:confused:
lol yeah, so is leaving sump plug out and pouring 5 liters of oil with nothing on the dipstick and thinking hmmmmmmm im sure this only takes 4.2ltrs:confused:
Like me wasting 50 quid on gearbox oil with leaky driveshafts before the car had moved lol
Tony Walker
09-04-2012, 00:04
lol.. funnily enough mine did the same thing after being stood for around a year, stupid nearside renault gaiters. cant say it cost me £50 tho :eek:
2 lots of oil, 2 driveshafts neither sealed up... Brand new shaft it was and oil, so considerably more than 50 lol and a crap smelling garage and mucky floor.
Tony Walker
09-04-2012, 00:16
Damn :( still need to clean my drive, probably pointless tho as ive no doubt it'll dump some more of something :sad2:
12 l of antifreeze in the GTA so I try and catch it when I have to drop the lumps :o
I went to Renault Notts the other day for some and they only had 10 l in stock.... which I bought , so you might not have any options Paul ;)
Tony Walker
09-04-2012, 08:57
12ltrs :( messy.
TNT ANDY
09-04-2012, 09:36
It couldn't be any more plain. The colour makes no difference, it's just a feckin' dye. What's important is whether the antifreeze is OAT or IAT (organic or inorganic).
Stick whatever colour you want in as long as it is IAT (i.e. as per Renault o.e.).
Do not put OAT in, whatever the colour, because there's a chance it will screw your engine.
Why take the risk :rolleyes:
We need a face plant smiley for RTOC.
:laugh: What colour should I put in:confused:
New cars = Organic
Old sheds = Non organic
Kinda makes sense if you think about it.
Thanks for the really useful info guys.
NON ORGANIC EVERYONE
gttjames
09-04-2012, 12:24
i thought you allways bought the same colour coolant as your hoses :cartman: so red for me :)
My renault one was green :)
I think this thread continued because the advice being given out was dog sh*t. That's not the case now and I'm glad others have come forward to add their experiences and knowledge so there's no confusion over what C1J owners should be doing.
JRP, you tickled me like a trout you fecker :D
I don't think any of the advice has been dog ****, just people have different opinions and experiences :)
I think this thread continued because the advice being given out was dog sh*t. That's not the case now and I'm glad others have come forward to add their experiences and knowledge so there's no confusion over what C1J owners should be doing.
JRP, you tickled me like a trout you fecker :D
:agree::laugh:
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