View Full Version : cams?
at the moment i have a 270 piper cam, planing on getting a vnt so would i also need to uprate the came, got pretty much the yellow spec bbt engine and uprated cooling system just after advice on the cam now, i have just also dropped the engine out of my 5 so doing it would not be a massive problem thanking you
Andrew Cooke
04-11-2008, 19:04
with a VNT I'd stay stick with the 270.
Andrew Cooke
04-11-2008, 19:06
was that a piper 270, or a BB 270? I seem to recall that the BB270 was a piper 285, anyone agree?
i would like to say its a bb 270 but a friend of mine has a 285 piper and it seems to run abit rough sorta but mine doesnt, or does that mean his is not fuelling properly?
just had a look in the bills i got from the previous owner it says 270 performance cam which will prob mean a bbt cam i woud think
just had a look in the bills i got from the previous owner it says 270 performance cam which will prob mean a bbt cam i woud think
My piper 270 said something like Pb270 on it. idles slightly rougher than standard but at 4K and above its great!! running with a T2/T25 at 14psi. did'nt explode at mallory :) so reliable and drivable.
am i right in saying the 285 kicks in at a higer rpm than the 270?
Matt Cole
05-11-2008, 21:13
I orderd a bb285 and it said bp270 on it!:sad2:
markey b
05-11-2008, 21:47
i'm still running std cam with my VNT...
I orderd a bb285 and it said bp270 on it!:sad2:
That's interesting??:confused: So do i have a piper 270, or is a Pb270 a 285 really. In that case do i need uprated rings?? Surely a 285 would have 285 stamped on it?? :scared:
am i right in saying the 285 kicks in at a higer rpm than the 270?
Summit to do with overlap at idle (More = rougher i think) and the 285 needs uprated rings so to stop spring bounce at big rev?? i think the 270 was designed more for mid range hence the turbo im running and the 285 is better suited to high rev's using a T25 or higher. Somebody will know more than me!!;)
wright im with you so a 270 would be better suited for a t3 say to try and conunter the lag
Andrew Cooke
07-11-2008, 18:43
wright im with you so a 270 would be better suited for a t3 say to try and conunter the lag
no, you match the cam to the turbo, if you don't like the lag fit a smaller turbo
i get there is going to be lag with a bigger turbo but the top end is where you see far more benifts then say a t2, so would you fit say a 285 with a t25
put another way andrew why did you suggest a 270 with a vnt?
what andy's saying is that you need to know what you want your engine to do before you build it. if you want to make a lot of power at the expense of responce then you're going to be fitting a bigger turbo. Once you've made that choice you fit a cam that suits the turbo, you don't pick the cam first. you can get away with a lairier cam if you're running a bigger turbo/turbine. with a smaller or standard turbo you wouldn't want to run much more than a bp270 say.
well was thinking of the 1/4 mile really, the car has already got a bb270 fitted, at the moment it has a t2 fitted which i really want to change, already got a oil cooler fitted and a fmic etc for cooling so thought a vnt would be a good choice with the fueling sorted out
the 5 is a weekend car really so not bothered about daily performance
Andrew Cooke
07-11-2008, 20:54
what andy's saying is that you need to know what you want your engine to do before you build it. if you want to make a lot of power at the expense of responce then you're going to be fitting a bigger turbo. Once you've made that choice you fit a cam that suits the turbo, you don't pick the cam first. you can get away with a lairier cam if you're running a bigger turbo/turbine. with a smaller or standard turbo you wouldn't want to run much more than a bp270 say.
that's what I was saying :D
When the VNT closes down it's more restrictive than the standard turbo, you don't want any overlap with small turbines, it'll kill the power/spool/engine. The Piper 270 has more lift than the standard cam, with similar overlap making it a good match to the VNT.
Now I realise that I'm opening myself up for all sorts of 'I run xxx cam with my VNT, and it's awesome' type comments, but this is my opinion and I'm sticking with it. I will listen to anyone who's tried a Piper 270 against any other cam with a VNT as a comparison.
Andrew Cooke
07-11-2008, 20:59
well was thinking of the 1/4 mile really, the car has already got a bb270 fitted, at the moment it has a t2 fitted which i really want to change, already got a oil cooler fitted and a fmic etc for cooling so thought a vnt would be a good choice with the fueling sorted out
the 5 is a weekend car really so not bothered about daily performance
as above, I think the bb270 is a Piper 285, you need to check that before getting all excited about spending. If you can check the valve lift you should have a pretty good idea what the cam is. BTW, a Piper 285 is a bit pants with a T2.
thanks for the reply, so i think i will give bb a call to find out, but it does make sence about your cam xchoice thanks
Andrew Cooke
07-11-2008, 21:25
thanks for the reply, so i think i will give bb a call to find out, but it does make sence about your cam xchoice thanks
I wouldn't bother, just measure the lift. Sometimes things ain't what they're supposed to be.
i gave them a email anyways and your right andy:agree:
bb had piper do the cams for them and called them the bb270, after a while piper decided to make the same version and call it the 285.........or so bb say
Piper were knocking out the 285 cams long before BB jumped on the band-wagon.
Andrew Cooke
08-11-2008, 11:41
Piper were knocking out the 285 cams long before BB jumped on the band-wagon.
which 285, that low lift shocker that you were touting around as some secret special deal, or the current one? ;)
Andrew Cooke
08-11-2008, 11:47
i gave them a email anyways and your right andy:agree:
bb had piper do the cams for them and called them the bb270, after a while piper decided to make the same version and call it the 285.........or so bb say
assuming that the cam is what they say it is - mistakes have been made before - it'll be the 112deg LSA one which will be happier with a VNT than the latest 110deg LSA version.
btw, a lot of the confusion comes from the Piper 285 being a 270deg cam. 285 is Piper's way of saying fast road/rally spec, and isn't related to the number of degrees.
That sticker on the bonnet is the dogs danglies.
which 285, that low lift shocker that you were touting around as some secret special deal, or the current one? ;)
:D Hey, that was a great cam ;)
I meant 285's for the gtt in general.
Saying that, I thought BB's cam was a CatCams jobby?
Andrew Cooke
08-11-2008, 11:50
That sticker on the bonnet is the dogs danglies.
PMSL since Mart is on line "FAIL"
Andrew Cooke
08-11-2008, 11:56
:D Hey, that was a great cam ;)
I meant 285's for the gtt in general.
Saying that, I thought BB's cam was a CatCams jobby?
if what you had was the original 285, and BB had that bit of lift added (I can't see it doing anything other than sound good on the spec sheet) they could well say that the 285 came from their design. A bit like Mike 48 could claim that the current 285 (ultimate?) was his design (or was it really CTM all along :D)....
Correct, the latest BB (is it called the ultimate?) cam is a Catcam jobbie. And before anyone asks, no it isn't one of the ones advertised on the catcams website, so I doubt you can buy it direct.
Which begs the question, why didn't Piper advertise those different specs as individual cams/part numbers? eg, even if they had called them 285a, 285b, 285c etc for each 'revision' that was released, it wouldn't have been as confusing as it is now.
Andrew Cooke
08-11-2008, 12:06
Which begs the question, why didn't Piper advertise those different specs as individual cams/part numbers? eg, even if they had called them 285a, 285b, 285c etc for each 'revision' that was released, it wouldn't have been as confusing as it is now.
what, a bit like EBC Green?
the last thing they want to do is add revisions, the poor customers are confused enough, and if some muppet hadn't gone around measuring them noone would have been any the wiser.
Mudslinger
08-11-2008, 12:25
my so called fast road cam , was stamped 270 , but mr cooke confirmed it was actually a 285 :)
my so called fast road cam , was stamped 270 , but mr cooke confirmed it was actually a 285 :)
Yes that cam is now in emmas lpg car:D Looking forward to getting the full t25 on it and getting away from the t2 back end that is on it now.
It will be interesting to see what difference in power it make now the turbo and cam are more suited to each other:D:D
Chris
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