Widetrack Conversion

[Os8472]

Ive been looking into widening the front track width on my car using Clio 16v wishbones, anti roll bar, driveshafts, hubs and track rods but what I cant find info on is what top mounts I have to use to prevent silly camber, any ideas?

[Spooky]

You'll need custom or some sort of adjustable top mounts :crap:

[rs250nut]

Either use adj toy mounts or re drill the four holes that are all ready there, there have been a few threads about this mod but im not sure if any one has completed it yet.

[r5 rich]

i am now breaking a clio 1.8 16v if you need any parts as have the front subframe set up complete at present:)

[Andrew Cooke]

I'd have thought PH2 mounts with clio legs would work, try it and report back.

[markey b]

the ones i've seen i'm sure the wheels dont sit central in the wheelarch....

surely there are better things to spend your hard earned on oliver :cooter:

[Andrew Cooke]

the ones i've seen i'm sure the wheels dont sit central in the wheelarch....

surely there are better things to spend your hard earned on oliver :cooter:
no they won't, they move the wheels forward to increase castor.

[andyrg]

i have calipers and a drivers shaft if required :)

[SCHWARTZ]

prima racing have done this to their 5, might be worth a try giving tony hart (i think it is) a bell and see if he will tell you what he did. prob be a trade secret or some crap like that tho :laugh:

[rs250nut]

no they won't, they move the wheels forward to increase castor.

Game on:agree:

[Os8472]

Right with Handy's help yesterday we fought a rusted clio valver at a scrappy and released the anti roll bar and the hubs, unfortunatly the wishbones were rotten (was planning on new 1s anyway) and the driveshafts were stuck fast.

So all I need is new wishbones, driveshafts and some form of top mount.

Looking at the clio setup the strut sits vertical off the hub in the same way the ph1 GTT or campus does so hopefully I can reuse my Avo's, as for the top mount I think a moddifed ph2 GTT top mount might work but won't know for sure until I can get hold of some and find 5 mins to try it all.

[markey b]

is it gonna be worth the time/effort/cost for the benefits? not bein negative dude just the whole EFI thing has cost u a fortune for little gain

[Woznaldo]

is it gonna be worth the time/effort/cost for the benefits? not bein negative dude just the whole EFI thing has cost u a fortune for little gain

That's subjective markey b. If you are talking about outright power then that may be the case but, if you're talking about drivability then the difference may be quite marked (no pun intended).

I think the wide track and extra castor would make quite a noticeable improvement, especially to 'turn in' but, that's just my opinion. It would also affect the Ackerman ratio but I'm not sure how much effect that would have.

[Nick k]

Is the Clio 16v got wide track?? I thought it was only the Williams that had the wide track fitted to it???? I've got a phase 2 valver and I'm sure it's not wide track?! If it is then result :) I never knew it was.

[Duncan Grier]

Is the Clio 16v got wide track?? I thought it was only the Williams that had the wide track fitted to it???? I've got a phase 2 valver and I'm sure it's not wide track?! If it is then result :) I never knew it was.

If I remember correctly the rear beam of the 16v and williams is the same but the front ARB / Wishbones etc etc are wider on williams

DG

[Andrew Cooke]

Is the Clio 16v got wide track?? I thought it was only the Williams that had the wide track fitted to it???? I've got a phase 2 valver and I'm sure it's not wide track?! If it is then result :) I never knew it was.

the 16V is wider than the R5
the Williams is wider than the 16V
the 172 is wider than the Williams

[Nick k]

Insert "your mum is wider than a 172" jokes here :)

[markey b]

That's subjective markey b. If you are talking about outright power then that may be the case but, if you're talking about drivability then the difference may be quite marked (no pun intended).

I think the wide track and extra castor would make quite a noticeable improvement, especially to 'turn in' but, that's just my opinion. It would also affect the Ackerman ratio but I'm not sure how much effect that would have.

thats fair enough woz, just thought for the cost of the conversion a set of road legal cut slicks and having proper suspension set up (tracking, corner weight etc) it'll be just as good, if not better for less money and effort

[HAndy]

there was a ppc article on prima racings car that used the williams wide track , had to fit williams anti roll bar and wider front arches:laugh: the valvers are about 10-12 mm on each side(approx) wider than the r5gtt, compared the two when building up the front subframe:cooter: also bearings in the valver hubs are bigger so that will cope better with bigger rims/or track action:p would go nicley with some cup rims ;);)

[Os8472]

is it gonna be worth the time/effort/cost for the benefits? not bein negative dude just the whole EFI thing has cost u a fortune for little gain

The fact is you know all the problems I've had with efi conversion have been down that idiot I trusted to make the parts I needed, had I of done it myself in the first place it would've been finished and working over a year ago. Besides running just 22psi with 2 major faults I was only 7bhp behind you, now there sorted I have only 1 thing left to do before it'll go back for mapping and should be 11bhp ahead + the 40mpg its already getting + the reliability + the lack of any emissions come MOT + the improved driveability.

Once done the valver track should give an extra 35mm on the front track, combine that with bearings that will take more abuse, the fact I'll have factory abs rings and sensors in place for road sensing launch control, lower boost in lower gears to reduce wheel spin, proper full throttle shift and if I put abs rings on the rear aswell I could have traction control :D

Yeah I think it'll be worth it

[sieger]

don't forget to make the rear end wider too, otherwise it will be tailhappy as h*ll

[Os8472]

don't forget to make the rear end wider too, otherwise it will be tailhappy as h*ll

Sounds like fun :)

Valver rear beam should do it nicely

[rs250nut]

Sounds like fun :)

Valver rear beam should do it nicely

Thats the only part where it wont matter if you use spacers or not, I cant remember the diffrence between the gt bar and the clio 16v/ williams bar.

[Os8472]

Thats the only part where it wont matter if you use spacers or not, I cant remember the diffrence between the gt bar and the clio 16v/ williams bar.

Spacers would be the easyer and cheaper option. Although the valver rear beam would mean abs rings on the back and a better hand brake

[TNT Tricky Nicky]

You can just sling Clio discs on the rear with abs rings fitted without changing beams, they're the same part number iirc

Sounds like a good plan ollie, may look into something like that when I rebuild mine :agree:

[markey b]

Spacers would be the easyer and cheaper option. Although the valver rear beam would mean abs rings on the back and a better hand brake

handbrake is the same, even raider has 172 calipers on the back as they are almost identical

ps. you'll never has a much torque as ginger, you got rid of the turbo that would have made it do that, plus you've now got a lag monster...

i wasn't being negative above btw, just 35mm wider for £x when you've already got R888 and having it corner weighted is easy as you've already got coilvers, you'd be better off spending the money on some lighter seats :cool:

[Alastair]

there was a ppc article on prima racings car that used the williams wide track , had to fit williams anti roll bar and wider front arches:laugh: the valvers are about 10-12 mm on each side(approx) wider than the r5gtt, compared the two when building up the front subframe:cooter: also bearings in the valver hubs are bigger so that will cope better with bigger rims/or track action:p would go nicley with some cup rims ;);)

Was this Tony Hearts old cup car that he rolled? I thought that had standard arches?

[Andrew Cooke]

Was this Tony Hearts old cup car that he rolled? I thought that had standard arches?

he did, I don't know what the current car is, but it's painted the same and has extended standard arches.

[rs250nut]

Spacers would be the easyer and cheaper option. Although the valver rear beam would mean abs rings on the back and a better hand brake

Is it not the discs with abs rings on? Your not going to have the sensor mounted to the disc are you.

[Os8472]

Is it not the discs with abs rings on? Your not going to have the sensor mounted to the disc are you.


Yeah the rings are on the discs, I'll have to make a bracket up off the caliper mount to hold the sensor but that can be done long term