starter motor

[modfather]

ok i got a bit of a problem i put in a different engine and box etc etc and put the starter in went to start it and im getting quite a savage noise from the starter :cry: sounds like its not engaging proper ( the locating dowel is in place )and can see some damage to the teeth on the flywheel so i got the aa out he reckons that the starter teeth does not match the flywheel teeth can this be

[James5]

ok i got a bit of a problem i put in a different engine and box etc etc and put the starter in went to start it and im getting quite a savage noise from the starter :cry: sounds like its not engaging proper ( the locating dowel is in place )and can see some damage to the teeth on the flywheel so i got the aa out he reckons that the starter teeth does not match the flywheel teeth can this be


Incorrect starter motor or locating dowel is in the correct palce?

[modfather]

Incorrect starter motor or locating dowel is in the correct palce?

the dowel is defo in the right place.
can it be wrong starter not enough teeth or to many teeth

[James5]

the dowel is defo in the right place.
can it be wrong starter not enough teeth or to many teeth


:laugh: meant incorrect place.

But yeah I would be looking at the starter motor being incorrect for use on C1J flywheel pattern.

[modfather]

:scratch: the starter did come off c1j

when i got the engine ( thats in now )there was no flywheel on it.
a while back (last year) i got a block from a member as i was going to rebuild it but never got round to it so i used the flywheel from that engine which also a c1j.
could they off put a different flywheel on that cij block

[modfather]

can any1 confirm this part number on this starter its valeo 77 01 499 247

[car.crash]

is this the slim new model starter you have that eats the ring gear on flywheels or the old original fat one.
put up a picture of it.

[modfather]

its a fatty 1

[car.crash]

that looks like the right one. any pics on the damaged ring gear?

[modfather]

heres a pic of the gear on starter doesnt look to bad most of the damage is on the flywheel right on the end of the teeth

[TrixNFlix]

Fancy taking a pic in focus rob?! :cooter:

[modfather]

Fancy taking a pic in focus rob?! :cooter:

i took that on the wifes phone im going to get some batterys and do with a camera

[car.crash]

is the ring gear located on the flywheel properly? as also said check the dowel. and make sure the started is fitted correctly and the starter is done up tight and sits flush.

[modfather]

yeap dowel defo sat in the right place ( in photo dowel sits in the red cirlced hole )
sits nice and flush with the box and done up tight as poss

[TrixNFlix]

How many teeth has it got? 9 is the norm, some uprated had 10

[modfather]

9 teeth

[modfather]

i took that on the wifes phone im going to get some batterys and do with a camera


wont be doing that then none of the batterys in the camera`s are any good :sad2:

[TrixNFlix]

ok, is it earthed properly? Try a big wire wedged round one of the starter motor holding bolts and ground it. It could be that the ring gear isnt jumping out as far as its supposed to and just touching the edge of your flywheel, causing that awful noise

[modfather]

yeah pritty sure earth ok as said in earlier post had the aa out and he thinks that the starter is not the right fit for the flywheel.
so if the starter is the right 1 and is fitted proper could it be the flywheel, is there a difference in flywheel size`s i say this because the damage to the flywhell is on the top of the teeth

[car.crash]

is the flywheel damage all the way round or just part way?

[modfather]

yeah i would say near enough all way round

[car.crash]

well im stumped then.

[SCHWARTZ]

I had this prob with my starter but played around with it for a couple of hours changing the dowel and bolts, ended up smacking it down with a hammer and it sorted it.:laugh: i ended up just using two bolts in the top two holes in the starter dont know if thats how it should be or what but it worked.

[SCHWARTZ]

forgot to mention my starter broke so i swapped it, couldnt get it to fit properly it ate the ring gear, changed the ring gear and it still didnt engage properly so i did what i previously said, hope this makes sense. :confused:

[modfather]

ive tried it with 1 bolt 2 bolts and 3 bolts still no different :brickwall: i have got a spare flywheel i am concidering swaping them over see if that makes a differnce

[modfather]

forgot to mention my starter broke so i swapped it, couldnt get it to fit properly it ate the ring gear, changed the ring gear and it still didnt engage properly so i did what i previously said, hope this makes sense. :confused:

the ring gear dont look as bad as the flywheel does

[car.crash]

the ring gear goes around the flywheel.

[TrixNFlix]

It does sound like you have chewed a bit too much off the flywheel. I would deffo try the extra earth on the starter first, as it worked for me before taking it off though.

[modfather]

It does sound like you have chewed a bit too much off the flywheel. I would deffo try the extra earth on the starter first, as it worked for me before taking it off though.


ok how would you do that then wire from where to where

[James5]

ok how would you do that then wire from where to where

Just place an earth cable from one of the bolts that hold the starter in place to a bare metal part of the chassis/ shell of your 5.

[modfather]

Just place an earth cable from one of the bolts that hold the starter in place to a bare metal part of the chassis/ shell of your 5.

1 of the bolts that go though the box to starter good enough

[SCHWARTZ]

forgot to mention my starter broke so i swapped it, couldnt get it to fit properly it ate the ring gear, changed the ring gear and it still didnt engage properly so i did what i previously said, hope this makes sense. :confused:

[modfather]

ok im going to try the earthing and going to hit it with hammer too see what happens i will update later big thanks to all that has helped :goodJob:

[James5]

1 of the bolts that go though the box to starter good enough


:agree: thats what i meant sorry

When you had the starter of was the cog that engages with the flywheel loose in anyway (should have no side to side movement if it has the bush at the end has gone this could cause grinding and eating of the flywheel ring gear), did you test it to make sure it engages / moves fine?
Whilst the starter motor is off the car did you test it to make sure it engages and works fine?? (with one of the jump leads run it from battery negative / earth to starter body and with the live jump lead run that to the constant feed on the starter, with a seperate well suited cable run that to the solenoid this will thjen enable the starter motor to work and you can see if it is engaging properly and not wonky etc.. (You will need to put your foot on the starter otherwise she will jump about).

[modfather]

ok heres the update gave the starter a clout and another earth and it has worked:yeah: turns over lovely just wont fire up got spark but when i got the carb was told it may well have bigger jets in so going to get some standard sized jets in and then im hoping that its going to start like it should

thanks again guys for you help

[TrixNFlix]

Happy days. :agree:

[modfather]

oh yes be even more happier when i got it running proper do you know what size the standard jets are

[James5]

oh yes be even more happier when i got it running proper do you know what size the standard jets are


120main
125 a/c
1.0 1st stage
1.0 2nd stage non removable jet (people drill out)

[modfather]

120main
125 a/c
1.0 1st stage
1.0 2nd stage non removable jet (people drill out)


brilliant just went to renault and they said they are not availble any more know anywhere to get some from

[James5]

brilliant just went to renault and they said they are not availble any more know anywhere to get some from

StuTHC was selling a load of jets in various sizes on this thread

http://www.rtoc.org/boards/showthread.php?t=9695&highlight=carb+jets

I am sure he will have some spare.

As said though you can't replace the 2nd stage so if it's been enlarged there is no going back to standard unless you are confident and want to drill and tap it to fit an a/c jet.

[modfather]

StuTHC was selling a load of jets in various sizes on this thread

http://www.rtoc.org/boards/showthread.php?t=9695&highlight=carb+jets

I am sure he will have some spare.

As said though you can't replace the 2nd stage so if it's been enlarged there is no going back to standard unless you are confident and want to drill and tap it to fit an a/c jet.



thanks i did just find a old carb i had lying around not sure what jets are in there.
how will i no if the jet has been drilled out

[James5]

thanks i did just find a old carb i had lying around not sure what jets are in there.
how will i no if the jet has been drilled out


The only way to find out is by using micro drill bits and graudal go up in size until you can't fit in (Don't force the mirco drill bits in) and that will tell you what size it was drilled out to.

[modfather]

The only way to find out is by using micro drill bits and graudal go up in size until you can't fit in (Don't force the mirco drill bits in) and that will tell you what size it was drilled out to.


drill bits around here having a laugh :laugh: have you got pic or diagram of which jets are which and where .
even if the jets are bigger would the car still run

[James5]

drill bits around here having a laugh :laugh: have you got pic or diagram of which jets are which and where .
even if the jets are bigger would the car still run


Pic 1 - 2nd Stage (non removable jet)
http://www.rtoc.org/files/Technical%20Files/Solex%2032%20Dis%20Carb%20Information/IMG_3315.jpg

Pic 2 - Air Corrector Jet
http://www.rtoc.org/files/Technical%20Files/Solex%2032%20Dis%20Carb%20Information/Ac%20jet.JPG

unfortunatly no pics of the main jet and the 1st stage but I am sure there is a section in the article bit.

Ok found it here's link
http://www.rtoc.org/boards/showthread.php?t=460

[modfather]

thats perfect i will have a look at my spare see whats in there
even if i got bigger jets in the carb on the car would it still start

[James5]

thats perfect i will have a look at my spare see whats in there
even if i got bigger jets in the carb on the car would it still start


Yeah should start but could be rich.

[modfather]

Yeah should start but could be rich.


ah well it does want to start.
just took spare carb to bits and found theres no main jet